FamilySearch. NEW 'Top' Line Menu is very "Disappointing". 'Web" version is NOT like "Mobile" Applic
Jordi Kloosterboer said: I think I like the create account button located at top right. It is a quick one click to create an account. I think maybe the sign in page could include the same header page as every other page and therefore look more consistent. Then you would still have the sign in and create an account stuff at the top. Not sure why they need a sign in with church account either because you should just create an account at that point.0
Juli said: Adrian, I know for sure that the Family Tree menu item went to Tree view, and I believe Search went to Records Search (https://www.familysearch.org/search/). Indexing went to Overview. I never use Memories, so no idea on that one.0
Adrian Bruce said: Hmmm. Thanks. That would seem familiar. I also have to say that, really, honestly, thinking of Windows Standards, that behaviour seems wrong. it's like clicking on the top level "File" menu item of a Windows program and expecting "File/New" to come up (assuming File/New is the top item on the File drop-down menu).
In fact, the more I think about it, the more I am certain that I was disoriented by the fact that (a) Menu item 1 actually brought up something rather than simply giving access to Menu items 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 etc. And (b) What menu item 1 brought up looked like menu item 1.1 - but why? It's a different menu item for goodness sake, so surely it should bring up something different??!! So yes, that behaviour resulted in disorientation on my part and this new item feels better.
So - restricting the top menu items to simply bringing up the drop down menu item (or is it bringing it down?) - yes, personally I agree with it - it feels cleaner and more understandable. Err, yes. From me, thank you FS.0
Alan E. Brown said: Gordon,
Note that the CREATE ACCOUNT button in the top right is there because it needs to be visible on all the tabs, not just the initial view. So the fact that there is another "Create a FREE Account" button on the initial view doesn't eliminate the need for the CREATE ACCOUNT button in the top right. The options need to be consistent for all the tabs while the user is not yet signed in.
For this whole discussion about how this looks when the user is not signed in, remember that it is very important to FamilySearch to encourage new users to create an account. So combining the two buttons into one is not likely to accomplish that goal.0
Adrian Bruce said: "it is very important to FamilySearch to encourage new users to create an account"
Alan - why use the word "encourage"? Shouldn't it be mandatory to have an account? Or at least, mandatory to access certain areas? If indeed it was just a question of encouragement, then yes, you'd want the "Create" option right at the top, as well as the Login button. But I've been thinking along the lines that people genuinely must have an account to go beyond something (not sure what) and therefore the two go together and could be combined into one.
Heidi's experience suggests that the encouragement is working too well for some!0
Alan E. Brown said: Given that there is no compulsion, I think "encourage" is the right word. It is certainly mandatory to have an account to access many areas of the site. However, many new visitors to the site need a reason to go through the process of creating an account, so that is why it is important to provide some portion of FamilySearch's valuable content before requiring an account.
People who already have an account will typically sign in quickly, since much of what they want to access does require them to be signed in. So I don't see how the presence of the CREATE ACCOUNT button is any particular burden for them -- they'll only see it for a few seconds.
In any case, I don't work on the website, so I'm offering my opinions on this topic simply as a user. Clearly there are some differences of opinion on this topic, but I think some good points have been made.0
W David Samuelsen said: I use right click...
I use Chrome and it does not open in new tabs any more.
ROLL BACK to previous version
I tried Firefox (with latest version), and it does not open in new tabs, it save as WHAT?! It's the same with every link.
see the absolute proof
Whoever programmer is, must be an hater of Chrome and Firefox for wrong reasons.0
W David Samuelsen said: Mine won't show the bars until I enlarge to 175 percent !! TOOOO BIIIIGGGGG fonts all over instead. (Good grief! I am using 27 inch wide Dell monitor!)
Whoever this programmer must be as blind as a bat can be!
Whoever this particular programmer is - must be a severe visually impaired one.
How many patrons do you think are savvy enough to understand drop down menus?0
Gordon Collett said: You just have to slightly modify your practice.
Left click to open the menu:
Then go down to your choice and either left click to open in the same window or right click to open in a new tab or window. It's hard to show it opening in a new tab by using command-click on my Mac, but here is my alternative of control-click which instead of just opening my default choice of new tab, lets me choose what to do with the link:
The change appears to have had as its goal to stop having the links do two things, that is, be both a link to open a menu and a link to open a new page.
It appears that most of the changes with the menu buttons were to make them act like menu buttons and to get them to function properly on touch screens.0
Brett said: Gordon
And, why can't the "Links" do two (different) things (depending) on which side of the 'mouse' you 'clicked' ...
What was wrong with that?
Why did it been to "Change" - It did NOT need to "Change", it was working just fine.
The usual problems/issues ...
- The unnecessary "Change" for the sake of "Change" ...
- "If it an't broke then don't fix it" ...
- Lack of "Consistency" - well, non-existent consistency really, across the board.
Rea Newell said: Thanks for the tip to click to see the drop down menu and then wheel click (or right click) to open in a new tab on the new top menu, although that wastes time. I would like to be able to wheel click on, say, Memories, as before and have it open in a new tab without all the extra scrolling and clicking. My time is precious, and when you add steps, I spend less time doing family history and more time navigating. Everything should open in a new tab with a wheel click!0
W David Samuelsen said: that message item - please restore the NUMBERS! You left us in dark.0
W David Samuelsen said: That programmer must be a LEFT_HAND !
I am right side and my mouse stay right side click. I am NOT going to modify mouse to be left side, period!0
W David Samuelsen said: I got a call from very very upset member user. BIG TIME!
The layout as seen in IPAD is all screwed up.
She was able to show me by way of video connection what it looks like.
Where's the SIGN IN? Nowhere in plain view. Not in usual place, upper right side. Not at all.
She said she tried the usual method she has done before - now getting msg that her account doesn't exist. The SAME message, telling her that her ward had been divided and she needs to create NEW account (HUH? ! ? !)
Found the sign in, and it was in tiny font size, BELOW the very BIG BIG BLUE BUTTON, telling us to create NEW ACCOUNT.
She signed in at that place. Much to her dismay...
the entire line after the green -colored "FamilySearch" is nowhere. Total BLANK.
"Family Tree Search Memories Indexing Activities Temple" not there at all.
She refreshed 3 times, not there.
So she continue to show me what it looks like after sign in. That line is not even visible.
Spotted her name in big blue hot-link, just below "Recommended Task" and "Recent People" in big font size.
Told her to click on that name, and it switched to her personal page. And there's that line now visible.
Adrian Bruce said: I'm confused there David. Left button click is the absolutely standard way that a mouse works to select anything - left button click to select which program to run, left click to select menu items in software, left click to select text and so on. Honestly, it's just the ordinary click in software - and if you have a touch screen, it's the only click, which is why I always get it in the neck from touch screen users when I refer to right button click.0
Adrian Bruce said: In fact, for clarity, I need to add that everything I just said refers to using a 2 button mouse in a Windows browser session.0
W David Samuelsen said: Left button click is NEVER standard. I have YET to find a mouse that is left standard for opening new tab. Instead of that, there is a set up program within Windows OS for those who are left-handed, to switch sides.
In fact practically EVERY mouse in Family History Library is automatically right clicked. The ones that aren't, are the ones the patrons can go into Windows to do the switch. At the end of the day, the mouses are automatically reset right-clicked.0
Jordi Kloosterboer said: FYI, right click for touch users is tap and hold.0
Jordi Kloosterboer said: Also, David, what you are referring to is opening a link in a new tab by default rather than on the same page. I personally prefer it that way because otherwise I would have to click the back button all the time and then refresh the page. It has nothing to do with being left handed whatsoever and I think you are overeating tbh. With family history, when I get into it, I usually have many tabs open at once so I can compare different things easily. I think that is what they are going after--that you can easily switch between tabs as the default to compare things if necessary.0
W David Samuelsen said: opening in new tab is my preference to do what you do. Right click mouses are factory and program defaults. NOT left-click, the left-handers have to go into program to switch the defaults.0
Adrian Bruce said: "I have YET to find a mouse that is left standard for opening new tab."
Now that I agree with. The crucial bit is opening a new tab - that's what I was missing from your description, sorry.
To select anything - like fire up a browser session by clicking or double clicking the browser's icon or close it down by clicking the X in the top right, we have to use the left button (assuming a two button mouse in Windows). But to fire up a something-screen in a browser in a new tab, no, that's not a left button click at all.
If I want to launch Search / Catalogue (say) I have to use my left button on the mouse to click "Search" - that drops down the menu instantaneously - the menu includes "Catalog". Now I have three ways to access the Catalog screen.
1. If I use my normal left button on the mouse, that opens up the Catalog in that tab. I don't particularly like that and I think you and Jordi don't either.
2. What I normally do is a "wheel-click" on "Catalog" in the menu - my mouse has two buttons and a scroll wheel in the middle. Clicking down on the scroll wheel when the cursor is over "Catalog" will launch the Catalog screen into a new tab. This, of course, is no help if you only have a two button, no wheel mouse.
3. The right click on "Catalog" in the menu brings up a little menu which has "Open link in New Tab", "Open link in New Window", "Open link in New Private Window", etc. To bring up Catalog in a new tab, I need to click on the first item in that list.
My problem is that all the above behaviour is absolutely standard Windows browser behaviour - what I don't remember is what happened beforehand with a right click on a menu option, rather than a wheel click on a menu option. If it's changed then I sympathise with the no-notice.
On the other hand, if a right click on a menu option really only brought up the option in a new tab, then it was handicapping the site by not giving all the options - I can, for instance, use my right-click in Firefox to launch the target option in Chrome - but that may be because of my Firefox add-ons.
Not sure where we are other than to agree with you totally about it being better to open in a new tab because I really, genuinely don't remember how to do that other than a wheel click, which still works for me.0
Adrian Bruce said: While it saves time fractionally on opening Memories or Search Historical Records, what about trying to get to the Catalog?
If I recall correctly (and it's amazing how quickly this slides from memory) to bring up the catalog using wheel clicks, you'd need to
- wheel click Search (top menu item);
- wait for Search Historical Records screen to load in a new tab;
- wheel click (or left click) Catalog on line 2;
- wait for the Catalog screen to load.
Now, I can:
- left click Search (top menu item) - the drop down menu appears immediately;
- left click Catalog on the drop down menu;
- wait for the Catalog screen to load.
That's two click and two screen loads for the old method versus two clicks and one screen load for the new method.
So the new method is faster for anything that isn't at the top of those menus - such as Search / Catalog, Family Tree / Find, Family Tree / Lists,, etc.0
Juli said: In Windows, another way to open a link in a new tab is Ctrl+(left) click. Another way to open a link in an entirely new window is Shift+(left) click.0
Ron Tanner said: BTW - you can hold Ctrl and do a left click to open in a new window.0
Gordon Collett said: What they are complaining about is that you can't right click or control left click or anything click on, for example, Memories and open anything in a new window. You have to do the click of any sort on Overview, Gallery, People, or Find in the drop down menu that opens after you click on Memories. (I personally like the new update and think the new menus work great!)0
Adrian Bruce said: To be honest, Gordon, I prefer the new setup as well. In the original UI, as you indicate, the top line of labels were dual purpose - links in their own right but also serving to drop down a menu where, I think, the top entry in the menu duplicated the link above. I honestly don't think that I've ever seen such dual behaviour anywhere else so I think that I should compliment FS for moving away from unusual behaviours.
The thing is that anyone who sees a lot more of FamilySearch than other sites might never have thought of the dual behaviour as odd.0
Tom Huber said: All,
For members of the Church who open the old lds.org (now https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/) site, the change to the new home/landing page behaves in the same manner as the church site. You have to click on the menu item to open the drop down. If nothing else, the sites are now consistent.0
Alan E. Brown said: The Volunteer link did not disappear; rather it moved. It is now in the footer of each page.0
Adrian Bruce said: I think I'm struggling to see why the "Help" icon is unnecessary - that really does need to remain visible as long as possible.
"Messages" icon - well, yes, I would have thought that should disappear into the hamburger first, not least because I'd have thought that most people look at messages on the way in and never again.
The points when the other icons appear and disappear, I have no particular view on.
Re Changing the way the top line behaved and why - sure, lots of people had in their "muscle memory" what they needed to do. But the site needs also to cater for new users who will expect menus to behave like menus and not as both links and menus - the new change will save time for those people and reduce their confusion. For them, that can only be a good thing.
Where it went wrong was - yet again, I'm afraid - in not warning people beforehand what to expect. Not warning them that as your window gets narrower, eventually the menus will disappear into the hamburger menu. Not warning them that the menus will become just pure menus and no longer links as well. That's when people like yourself fail to see the reason for a change - that's completely understandable if no-one's explained why things change and what the new things are.0