Promote the Family History Guide - especially for NEW Users

LegacyUser

Robert Wren said: Is there some reason the Family History Guide is not prominently promoted on FamilySearch.org?

Why is such a great TEACHING tool basically hidden from view?

"It has been used now for years to teach the missionaries at the Brigham Young University Family History Library and some of the missionaries at the Salt Lake City, Utah, Family History Library. It is used now by thousands of people around the world to advance family history and genealogy in a major way. It is an official training partner of FamilySearch.org." https://media.familysearch.org/what-i...

Could there be a link to it on the new user 'registry' page?

Leading the new user to a tool to help them better understand and use FSTree could be greatly helpful to ALL users. That understanding might minimize bad merges and unsourced PID's. It could help teach about RESEARCH.

There IS a mention in the "Solutions Gallery" (under "Games" & "Research"), a Lesson is found in "Help" and several references in the FS Wiki (mostly attached to FHC pages), BUT there does NOT seem to be a reference to it anywhere in the FS Tree pages.

Could it be at least placed in one of the drop-down menus at the top of the page OR on the person's Home Page or ?

This request was triggered by James Tanner excellent new blog post. "An Updated Look at the FamilySearch Solutions Gallery"
"Securely hidden at the very bottom of the pages of the FamilySearch.org website is the revamped Solutions Gallery. " https://rejoiceandbeexceedingglad.blo...

LegacyUser

Christine said: Yes!!! It was one of the classes at rootstech where we actually clapped during the presentations! I have shared it with all my Facebook friends, with ward members and neighbors, and with people who come into our work office who I know are interested in Family History. It is an AMAZING resource to help people learn and has tons of links to activities, training articles, blogs, etc. Everybody look it up!!!!!

LegacyUser

Janell Vasquez said: I love the FH Guide, don't get me wrong, but I'm not sure it's the best for new users. As it has grown and developed over the years, it's become a humongous resource, with something for everyone. Which also means that finding what I specifically need as an individual is like finding a needle in a haystack, if I don't already know what I'm looking for. And that's not a good experience for people new to family history. We call it the firehose approach, when someone new gets a whole ton of information dumped on them all at once.

People learn step-by-step, line-upon-line. And I know the FH Guide is meant to give that experience, but it's still too much for someone new to family history. It's great for teachers who point to a specific module and say here, do this piece right here. But let's not point those new to family history to the Guide as an answer to help them get started.

LegacyUser

Chris Mills said: As a completely new user, I would be delighted to see some more intro-level help for new users. I'm a computer programmer and write Help systems but have constant frustration at knowing the correct steps to take in FamilySearch. It's a fantastic resource and I'm extremely grateful for it being there but would really appreciate a simple 1-2-3 of getting started.

There are a couple of videos available but they seem to assume some current knowledge. As an example of what I have found confusing is understanding the difference between a Source and a Memory, and how to apply them. Yep, that's real basic but it's where a newbie will be at.

I've made a few attempts at writing a checklist so I can be consistent (and make the material useful to others) but keep having to start over as I've clearly misunderstood the correct process.

So any simple help for the real amateurs out here would be much appreciated. (If there is such a resource already please let me know, and perhaps add to the menu system.)

Thanks so much.

LegacyUser

Robert Wren said: Thank you, Janell, for your comments.

This was a two part suggestion - (1) Promote the FHGuide within FamilySearch & (2) Lead new users to it, when registering (not a requirement, simply a suggestion for them to 'learn before doing.')

Or, as another idea for new users - suggest (direct or lead) them to the BETA FamilySearch, where they can also LEARN, by doing; without making some beginner's errors for OTHER users to spend time repairing.

As you have apparently been a FS employee for a few years, could you advise us if there is a REASON for NOT promoting the FamilySearch Official approved training FHGuide somewhere on the website?

Granted it would be better for each new user to be guided by a trained FH consultant, but I'm fairly sure that is NOT happening.

While the FHGuide may not be "the best for new users," I would suggest that FamilySearch has also "become a humongous resource" and "finding what (one) specifically needs as an individual is like finding a needle in a haystack," - so, IMO, something IS NEEDED for training.

Do you believe that this "step-by-step, line-upon-line" FHGuide is too complicated? https://www.thefhguide.com/project-1-... (as you say, FHG has "something for everyone.")

Would you please advise us what instructions are given, or training suggested, currently, for new users?

If the FHGuide is NOT the answer, what is??

LegacyUser

Robert Wren said: Welcome to the Users' forum, Chris, Perhaps you could try this in the FHGuide: https://www.thefhguide.com/project-1-...

AND let's us know what you think?

LegacyUser

Chris Mills said: Thanks, Robert, for your speedy reply. I'm not sure if I missed that Guide somewhere but it's a FANTASTIC resource - thank you so much.

My Easter weekend will now be completely occupied - the house painting will have to wait!

Chris

LegacyUser

Brett said: Robert

CORRECT:

You are correct in that "FamilySearch" DOES NOT prominently promote "The Family History Guide" at the "Beginning" of "FamilySearch".

But, as you will already know, "FamilySearch" DOES actually promote "The Family History Guide" in "FamilySearch" under (Drop Down) "Help" and "Get Started", which opens up in "Help Centre" and "Lessons".

Namely:

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https://www.familysearch.org/ask/lear...

Introducing The Family History Guide

Presenter: Bob Taylor
The Family History Guide is a free website that helps you learn to use FamilySearch and achieve success in your genealogy.
Language: English

Introducing-TFHG.pdf ( https://ps-services-us-east-1-9142486... )

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GRANTED:

A little obscure.

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And, as you have also already indicated:

What is The Family History Guide?

https://media.familysearch.org/what-i...

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PLUS:

Again, as you have also already indicated there is a little bit of a "Guide" to "FamilySearch" on "LDS.org".

Namely:

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How to Use FamilySearch.org

https://www.lds.org/topics/family-his...

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Through, as you have also already indicated:

For more information, visit “The Family History Guide,” Project 1, Goal 1, Choice A. (http://www.thefhguide.com/project-1-f... )

==========

WHEREAS:

Perhaps, the reason that "FamilySearch" DOES NOT prominently promote "The Family History Guide" at the "Beginning" of "FamilySearch" in that "The Family History Guide" is NOT, part of; and/or, a product of, "FamilySearch".

Therefore, "FamilySearch" cannot be seen as prominently promoting a non-"FamilySearch" product at the "Beginning".

And, "The Family History Guide" is MUCH MORE than just "FamilySearch"

And, also the "Notice" on the "Landing" page/screen of "The Family History Guide"

Namely:

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Copyright 2019 The Family History Guide Association, a 501(c)(3) public charity organization.

All rights reserved.

The Family History Guide is solely responsible for the content on this website.

It is independent from FamilySearch and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, although both have approved the content of the site.

==========

Do not get me wrong, I am just throwing this in the mix.

Brett

LegacyUser

Adrian Bruce said: "As an example of what I have found confusing is understanding the difference between a Source and a Memory, and how to apply them. Yep, that's real basic"

Well I've been using FamilyTree for some years now and that's not basic at all in my view.

When you go to "Add Source" on a person's profile, the options include "Add New Source" and "Add New Memory Source".

The "Add New Source" option includes an option to "Add Memory" as a type of source.

The "Add New Memory Source" ends up at the same place as "Add New Source" albeit with the option to "Add Memory" pre-selected.

I personally think that having two options "Add New Source" and "Add New Memory Source" that end up in the same place is confusing.

Under the Memories tab, I can add all sorts of things, including Documents and Stories. But they are simply created at that point and might not be used as a Source. I think.

So - a Source might be a Memory, but not all Sources are Memories. And a Memory might end up used as a Source, but not all Memories get used as Sources. That is not a simple basic thing at all. (A Venn Diagram would show the situation better. Then again, it might also scare people!)

When I say "That is not a simple basic thing at all" that should not be interpreted as a criticism as such. I'm simply trying to get over that simple phrases may have something complex behind them and there's no shame in being puzzled.

LegacyUser

Chris Mills said: Thanks, Adrian, for your helpful feedback.

So, can you or anyone else please clarify if my definitions are correct:

A "Source" is an authoritative proof of an event, like a birth certificate or a web link to a recognised accurate listing.

A "Memory" is anything else relating to the person, like photos, letters, wills, etc.

The "Memories > Gallery" is a good place to store all documents, including Sources, but Sources are not treated as such until they are nominated as a Source through the Source box.

Hope I've got that right but any and all feedback welcome. Thanks.

(BTW, I haven't been able to get the Sources function to work over the last few days, using two different browsers - anyone have suggestions please?)

LegacyUser

Chris Mills said: Hi Brett - I read your detailed reply with interest and the links were extremely helpful.

However, the following mystified me:
"But, as you will already know, "FamilySearch" DOES actually promote "The Family History Guide" in "FamilySearch" under (Drop Down) "Help" and "Get Started", which opens up in "Help Centre" and "Lessons".

If I go Help > Getting Started I see three videos and a column on the right with Local Help (in this case Mackay, Queensland, Australia) but no Lessons.

I just thought I should mention it in case there are regional differences (or maybe I just need new glasses!).

Thanks again.

Chris

LegacyUser

Brett said: Chris

'G'Day'

'No', no regional differences, I'm in "Sydney".

And, you DO NOT even have to have an "Account" for "FamilySearch".

I was not even "Logged-In".

My mistake though:

"Help" >>. "Learning Centre" (which in pre-populated with "Getting Started" )

Automatically "Defaults" to "Lessons".

13'th lesson down the list - on the second lot.
https://www.familysearch.org/ask/lear...

(by the way, to get more lesson you need to go down to the bottom; and, it refreshes and goes down further)

I am sorry, I hope this is more helpful.

Brett

LegacyUser

Chris Mills said: Hi Brett -

G'Day back.

Found it, thanks.

I was going Help > Getting Started. Help > Learning Center got it. Lots of good stuff in there. Pity 'bout the spelling, though.

Have a good day.

Chris

LegacyUser

Brett said: Chris

I am hopeless at spelling; so, I never complain about any one else.

But, what you have to remember is that the Headquarters of the Church is in the "United States of America"; hence, the "American" English version of spelling, not what we are used to.

Brett

ps: I am sure out "American" 'Cousins' find our spelling equally ...

LegacyUser

Chris Mills said: Yep, was only kidding.

LegacyUser

Brett said:

LegacyUser

Adrian Bruce said: Chris - here's my personal take on those definitions:

A Source is something containing information (evidence might be a better term) relating to the genealogy of a person or group of persons.

Note that it doesn't have to be authoritative or even true though why you'd want to record in such a case is a moot point - maybe it's just a good story, maybe, even though nonsensical in itself, together with others, it suggests something real.

A Memory is a FamilySearch term and appears to mean a file that you, the user, have created. They might be photos, text-based stories, etc. They might also be reports - I sometimes use them for explanations like why I think this chap in Tasmania (say) is actually this chap in Stockport and not that chap in Chorley who happens to have the same name.

It seems to me that it's a bit daft for me to say that I'm contributing "Memories" of someone who lived 500y ago when I'm writing a report about them, but there it is.

A Source in FamilySearch FamilyTree is one of, I suggest, 3 types:
1. Created by FamilySearch and held in the Historical Records. These might be images of documents or indexes to documents held elsewhere. (These end up with the tree icon)

2. A file that you, the user, have created. In other words, these are Memory Sources. You create these on the Sources tab for a person with the Add Source / Add New Memory Source command, though you might actually already have put the memory into the Gallery and you're just linking it.

3. Sources created by someone else - perhaps on another web-site, perhaps as a published book, perhaps as a paper document in an archive. You create these on the Sources tab for a person with the Add Source / Add New Source command. They end up with the globe icon.

LegacyUser

Adrian Bruce said: Chris - when you said,
"A "Source" is an authoritative proof of an event, like a birth certificate or a web link to a recognised accurate listing. "
My comment would be, as I indicated above, it doesn't have to be authoritative, a proof, or accurate. It's just got to be relevant. Although, as I said above, it would be odd to bother about inaccurate, etc sources!

You said:
"A "Memory" is anything else relating to the person, like photos, letters, wills, etc. "
Not necessarily "anything else". You might have a copy of someone's birth certificate and decide to load that up as an image if it's not in FamilySearch's Historical Records. That would be loaded up as a Memory, if I understand things correctly. Then you can nominate that particular Memory as a Source (a Memory Source, in fact), in some fashion, as you suggest - probably several ways of doing that, there usually are!

I suspect some people may argue with my idea that a source "doesn't have to be authoritative or even true"!

A lot of this stuff seems like it should be easy at first glance, then when you start thinking and trying to understand things, it's not quite as easy as you thought... That's 'cos real life isn't like that either...

LegacyUser

Chris Mills said: Hi Adrian -

Many thanks for your detailed & helpful reply.

Much appreciated.

Chris

LegacyUser

Janell Vasquez said: I am not in those conversations so I don't have any official answers as to specific reasons for using or not using certain resources in certain places.

What I know is that we are interested in making the getting started experience better. The solutions I am seeing people at FS work on are four-fold:
- Make the website more simple and provide walkthroughs so that it doesn't need a lot of training to get started. Provide on-screen help.
- Teach consultants to have one-on-one personalized sessions with individuals to help them get started.
- Encourage individual activities (through tasks, discovery activities, etc.) that help people dip their toes in the water in easy ways so they can learn little bits at a time.
- Make it easy to ask for help when needed.

And there may be more. We're not to the ideal in any of these areas, but that's what we're working towards.

To answer your question about that specific page on the fhguide, no, I don't believe that it in and of itself is complicated. But there are still things about it that are complicated:

1. As an individual getting started, how do I know that that is where to start for the specific thing I want to do? That step is teaching me how to navigate the tree, but when I get into the tree, I don't want to have to learn how to navigate the tree. People come to the Tree and have a specific task in mind that they want to do. Navigating the tree is secondary to that task.

For example, what if the first thing I want to do is look for a story that I'd heard about my grandfather? This step might help me to do that, but it also gives me a whole lot of instruction that I don't want or need to do my specific task. People are task oriented. They don't want to have to learn to use the whole site to do the one task they want to do.

If I want to do something different, the fhguide might be able to help me know how, but how do I know where in the fhguide to go to find what I need?

2. A lot of the things in these steps are simple enough for many people who are familiar with technology to figure out on their own, without a guide. (Yes, I know that many who are not as familiar with technology need this, so this doesn't apply to everyone.) But for those who can figure technology out, this step might have 10 minutes worth of instruction that they could figure out in 2 minutes of clicking around on their own. It might have 1-2 nuggets in there that would take them longer to figure out on their own, but they aren't going to wade through the whole thing to find those 1-2 nuggets.

Know that I am NOT knocking the fhguide. It's a great resource. But I think it's built more for consultants - who need to know all the ins and outs of it all so they can help others - than for the average user just getting started, because it doesn't take into account how people naturally learn.

LegacyUser

Adrian Bruce said: The old joke about only reading the manual when things go wrong has a lot of truth for a lot of people.

LegacyUser

Robert Wren said: We just updated some of our FHC Computers to Windows 10.

The home page is set to go directly to familysearch.org. But they have added a bookmark line below it with "FamilySearch" (repeating), FHC Portal (the old standard FHC page), Indexing, FS Wiki, Consultant Planner (which I guess is now the wrong name, but it leads to the "Calling" page) AND Self-Reliance (not sure of the connection to FS)

That's a good setup for FHC's, but I wonder WHY they do not at the FHGuide as one of the items. What better place to promote than at the FHC? Actually a 'better' place may still be on the "new user 'registry' page" - At least some of them might respond by "learning - before doing."

Even Web Indexing leads new users through minimal batch training.

FWIW, I'll be adding the FHGuide to the bookmarks here in this FHC!

LegacyUser

Bob Taylor said: I'm a bit late on this thread, but I will offer some insights from the perspective of The Family History Guide.

Q1: Why doesn't FamilySearch do more to visibly promote The Family History Guide on its site?
A1: Brett explained it pretty well in the comments above: because The Family History Guide is not owned by FamilySearch, they do not want to promote it above other partners such as Ancestry, MyHeritage, etc. who also do not appear in the Help drop-down list. We understand and support that policy. From our perspective, it means that we must rely more on grass-roots support and adoption, instead of FamilySearch actively promoting The Family History Guide.

Q2: Is The Family History Guide effective for beginners?
A2: Here, I would respectfully disagree with a number of Janell's points.
a) In the Home screen there are now tiles where you can choose your path, discover your passions for family history, and browse a number of simple activities in the Get Started page.
b) There is a complete Computer basics section for learning everything from mouse skills to desktop and social media apps.
c) Users don't have to start at Project 1, Goal 1, Choice 1 with tree navigation. They can skip to stories, for example, in Project 2 Goal 8. If a particular Choice is not relevant, it can be closed so it doesn't appear on the screen.
d) If a particular item is hard to find in The Family History Guide, there are several solutions: 1) Click Search (top of the page); 2) Use the Topics page (Intro menu); and 3) Use the Site Map (Intro menu).

We have had a lot of beginners mention to us that the site is very helpful for getting started. We have Show-Me videos and links to video tutorials for visual learners; we have links to articles for readers; and step-by-step instructions for those who prefer that.

Hope that helps!

Bob Taylor
CEO
The Family History Guide Association

LegacyUser

Robert Wren said: Thanks for weighing in, Bob (and for your FHGuide leadership). I think new user Chris' comments above should adequately express the rationale for this topic's request.

Promotion to new users would have NO negative effect on FS' other partners - in fact it would likely HELP them.

LegacyUser

Bob Taylor said: We think alike on that point!

LegacyUser

Robert Wren said: Just thought I'd reintroduce this idea of promoting the FHGuide to new users, I'm likely out of date & old fashioned, but learning before doing always seems to work better - at least for me!!!

Someone in FS authority like to explain the reason for NOT trying it???

LegacyUser

A van Helsdingen said: At the bottom of the homepage of the FHG is the following message:

"Copyright 2020 The Family History Guide Association, a 501(c)(3) public charity organization. All rights reserved.
The Family History Guide is solely responsible for the content on this website.
It is independent from FamilySearch and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, although both have approved the content of the site"

The FHG is not run by or in a formal relationship with FS- though it seems to be on good terms. FS already tries to do many of the things the FHG does through the FS Wiki and other learning opportunities.

There are many other websites and resources that help individuals learn how to do genealogy. FS can't promote FHG while choosing to overlook the others without entering into some sort of arrangement with FHG. As Bob Taylor, FHG CEO pointed out previously in the thread, to promote FHG may be violation of agreements with other partners. MyHeritage for example has been pushing its education section in recent months.

If you think the FHG is a good learning tool and that FS users should be aware of then, then you can edit the Wiki and insert mentions of the FHG where and if that is appropriate.

LegacyUser

Bob Taylor said: Thanks - that sums up the issue pretty well. FamilySearch approves The Family History Guide as a training resource, but we (The Family History Guide Association) do not state that they endorse it, recommend it, etc. Our relationship with FamilySearch is managed by Steve Shumway, who also manages the Ancestry account.

We appreciate the "grass roots" efforts of the many people who use and promote The Family History Guide around the world. And thanks, Robert, for your kind words and support.

LegacyUser

Tom Huber said: "FS can't promote FHG" -- Absolutely, It could, however, provide more of a link than is found in the Solutions Gallery.

However, that could be misconstrued, so I understand why FamilySearch does not provide any reference (other than in the Wiki or Solutions Gallery).

You are correct in suggesting that we edit and add the reference in the appropriate places in the FS Wiki.