Ordinances Ready needs to be actually ready

LegacyUser

S. Rodman said: I just checked the Ordinances Ready feature in Family Search, the only accurate categories were Baptism and Initiatory. In the other categories, Endowment, Sealing to Parents, and Sealing to Spouse, Ordinances Ready supplies names where the leading ordinances have not been done for either the person (endowment before Initiatory) or parents (sealing before either or both Initiatory and endowment were done for the child) and sealing to spouse where one or both people were lacking either or both Initiatory and endowment. You may check the Ordinances ready under my account, and you will see this is true. In NOT ONE Case from Ordinances Ready, were the Endowment or either sealing (Parents or Spouse) ordinances correctly sequenced. When I print Family Ordinance cards, Item 3 clearly states "Whenever possible, a couple should be endowed before being sealed to each other, and Parents should be sealed to each other before their children are sealed to them. Also, the Temple Ordinance card itself gives the order for ordinances: Baptism, Confirmation, Initiatory, Endowment, and lastly, Sealing to Parents. Supplying Ordinances Ready that are NOT really ready violates the sacred order of the ordinances, it is dishonest, and very frustrating. Please, PLEASE fix this, so that Ordinances Ready can be both honest and useful. Other people in my ward Family History Center have the same frustration. This feature was probably introduced to get people to do SOMETHING. However, when someone is given a name without the proceeding ordinances, they are cheated from the special connection possible when the person they are representing can be present and glad to have the ordinance done. For coding this is a "If-Then" sequential check to ensure the ordinances are supplied in correct order.

LegacyUser

David Newton said: Please go and look up what "whenever possible" means in a dictionary.

Then come back and explain how your misapprehension of the meaning of that phrase has led you to to launch into a post that is based on a false premise and is therefore factually invalid.

LegacyUser

Brett said: David

As a non-member you do not fully understand this post.

You have cited one particular point; and, in fact, taken that out of context.

The Member User/Patron, 'S.Rodman', has valid concerns, that need to be addressed.

Please let Member Users/Patrons try to help in this post.

Brett

.

LegacyUser

Christina Sachs Wagner said: The Temple Department has oversight of Ordinance Ready and as such, the programming follows all *current* temple policies. There have been some changes made to "traditional policy" concerning Ordinance Ready to hasten the work being completed.

Here are two links that may help you understand this policy change:

https://www.familysearch.org/help/sal...

https://www.familysearch.org/help/sal...

Here is a quote from the second Knowledge Article link:
"Ordinances Ready
The Ordinances Ready feature allows sealings to be done before the individual ordinances. While performing all ordinances in proper sequence is preferred, it is acceptable to perform sealing-to-spouse ordinances without checking that the individual ordinances have been performed."

Sealing to parents may be completed before the parents' individual work, including their sealing, but is preferred in the proper sequence *if* you "own" all the reservations to complete them in order. This is especially true for inlaws of our relatives. You are not authorized to perform the ordinances of the parents of your relative inlaws, but the seal to parents belongs to the child and they don't want that last ordinance "on his card" left incomplete. This is where the "when possible" comes in.

You do not need to use Ordinance Ready if you are uncomfortable with this change, but also know that it is hastening the work and the temple department leaders approve of the changes made and encourage us to use it and consultants teach it to patrons.

Here is a great link by Gordon Collett that helps us teach an effective way to help patrons understand how to maximize the use of this program.

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/...

LegacyUser

Brett said: S. Rodman

Much of what you have raised here, was discussed with you; and, proffered to you, in your fist post in this Forum some 4 Months ago - I know; because, I was one of those who responded.

Don't violate ordinance order!
https://getsatisfaction.com/familysea...

You do not seem to have, understood, grasped; and/or, accepted, the "Knowledge Articles" in "FamilySearch" that were proffered to you, on the matters, you have raised in your previous post:

Correct order of temple ordinances
https://www.familysearch.org/ask/sale...

Why are the temple ordinance dates out of order in Family Tree?
https://www.familysearch.org/ask/sale...

Why was a sealing ordinance done out of order?
https://www.familysearch.org/ask/sale...

Nor, do you seem to have, taken in; and/or, grasped; and/or, understood, important information in, the previous post in this Forum that were proffered to you in you previous post.

As 'Christna' has rightly proffered (like what was proffered in your previous post), the "Temple" Committee (Headed by Elder "David A. BEDNAR", of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles); and, by extension, the "Temple" Department of the Church, has oversight and sanctioned the way "OrdinancesReady" works (in "FamilySearch") - which has been implemented to hasten completion of this very IMPORTANT Work.

Please take the time to, read; and, take in/grasp, what was proffered to your in you previous post.

And, hopefully YOU will be able to HELP the Others in the "Family History Centre" in your Ward with the concerns that you have raised.

I hope this puts things into perspective.

Brett

.

LegacyUser

S. Rodman said: Whenever possible means there is some effort to determine what is and is not possible, rather than just tank a name, do no checking, and go merrily on your way.

LegacyUser

S. Rodman said: Thanks Christina, this is helpful, I appreciate it.

LegacyUser

Christina Sachs Wagner said: You're welcome!

LegacyUser

Christina Sachs Wagner said: Your're welcome!

Melora

I'm reading the thread on Ordinance Ready. I don't really have males in my family (that are church members) to do ordinances for ancestors, so I generally end up sharing names with the temple. Occasionally I hold out a name, hoping a nephew or someone will do it,. More often someone I don't know has reserved ordinances that precede sealings, so I do not seal children to parents nor their spouses. I don't do this because I am waiting for the proper sequence, just as we do them in the temple. I just wonder where the line is before this becomes a hap-hazard occurence of sealings-even-if-preceeding-SACRED-ordinances haven't been performed?

Because I live fairly near a temple, I can wait. They have.

Thanks.

Melora Bacheller Hiler

Brett .

@Melora

Welcome to the "Community.FamilySearch" Forum.

I am just another 'lowly' User/Patrons ...

[ And, one who is a member of the Church ... ]

As an aside ...

One does not really have to be too concerned ...

We have been advised, that regardless if "Ordinances" are done 'Out of Sequence', not to worry; as, those "Ordinances" that are done 'Out of Sequence' simply DO NOT take effect, UNTIL the prerequisite "Ordinances" are "Completed".

And, most importantly ...

"Ordinances" that are done 'Out of Sequence' DO NOT have to be done again; as, they are STILL "Valid".

Here are some "Knowledge Articles" in 'FamilySearch':

Ordinances performed out of order

https://www.familysearch.org/help/helpcenter/article/ordinances-performed-out-of-order

Which states, among other things:

Quote

------------------

Vicarious ordinances performed out of sequence are valid, but they become effective only after the prerequisite ordinances are completed.

------------------

And ...

Correct order of temple ordinances

https://www.familysearch.org/help/helpcenter/article/correct-order-of-temple-ordinances

Which states, among other things:

Quote

------------------

Although vicarious ordinances performed out of sequence are valid, they become effective only after the prerequisite ordinances are completed.

------------------

I hope this helps, somewhat.

Brett

Melora

Thank-you, Brett. Yes, this does help. I am at peace. :)

Brett .

😀

GwynnJohn

My response to the policy of allowing ordinances to be done out of order is simple. It is not allowed to temple patrons during mortality so why is it allowed after mortality? What is the purpose in putting an ordinance on "hold?" The silly example that comes to my mind would be to let a football player kick 20 field goals and then let the final score of the next 20 games be adjusted to include the field goals. I admit it is silly but do you get the point? (no pun intended) During calendar year 2019 I personally did the endowments for 400 of my ancestors. Unfortunately, the sealings for dozens of couples and children to parents were stolen from the joy I wanted to share with those ancestors. I know, someone is going to say to me, "Why didn't you reserve the 400 names ahead of time?" To that person or persons I say, "Be realistic! I didn't have 400 names ahead of time. I spent many hours finding some of the names and getting the B, C, and I done for them in one week so I could do the E in the next. And, everything was done in order except the sealings that were done before I even found the names." --- John Gwynn