United States of America

LegacyUser

Robert Joseph Wallace said: I served a mission in Brazil. The official name of the country, in English, is The United States of Brazil. And the people found it annoying and offensive that we called ourselves simply the United States. And there are other countries around the world that do the same.
Now, official policy of FamilySearch is that we can't call ourselves The United States of America, because any place name using our full name is not in "Standard Form". I believe this policy should change, for the reason stated above. Besides, if you read Elizabeth Mills Shown on the topic, she states we should never call ourselves just The United States, because it is ambiguous abbreviation, because other countries call themselves the United States of ... She insists that we are the United States of America.

LegacyUser

Jordi Kloosterboer said: But, when speaking in English, this is the only country called the United States. It is not ambiguous in English. In Portuguese, the standard is Estados Unidos da America.

Therefore, I feel like "United States" should not be changed for the English language.

LegacyUser

Brett said: Robert

I totally agree with you.

I am not from the "United States of America".

But, I do have Ancestors and relatives there.

For the life of me, I do not know why the "Standard" in "FamilySearch" for the "United States of America" is ONLY the "United States".



I refuse to leave any such Place Name only ending in just the "United States"; and, always end any such Place Name with "Unites States of America".

I am so glad another User/Patron brought this matter up.

Great post.

Brett

LegacyUser

Adrian Bruce said: An interesting point, Jordi. However, I would say that anyone reading FS FamilyTree in English might not understand the standards and might indeed be confused. Although, in practice the confusion can surely only come if a birthplace (say) quotes only the country - I doubt anyone is really going to wonder if Vermont is in Brazil?

Maybe the annoyance (when working in English) is the important thing rather than confusion.

LegacyUser

Adrian Bruce said: I tend to feel something of the same, Brett. After all, it's not as if the citizens of that country tend to use "United States" exclusively, discarding the "America" - as I recollect, their sports fans seem to chant "GO USA!!" so the A for America is recognised.

LegacyUser

Adrian Bruce said: An important concern is - what would happen if the standard were changed?

Display within FS FamilyTree wouldn't change much - there'd just be a longer name for updates, one still recognisable.

Searching however - hmm. That's searching within FS FT and from FS FT to the Historical Records - I suspect that searching the Historical Records will still work but I wouldn't swear to there not being loading issues if the software needs to look for synonyms or partial matches instead of direct matches.

LegacyUser

Adrian Bruce said: Of course, speaking not entirely seriously, "United Kingdom" is as big a problem... That's the "United Kingdom of the Netherlands ... the unofficial name given to the Kingdom of the Netherlands as it existed between 1815 and 1839" is it? (See URL https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_...)

And in the case of the UK, there isn't even a simple change as there are 2 full versions - "United Kingdom of Great Britain & Ireland" and "United Kingdom of Great Britain & Northern Ireland". Oh dear. (And please don't ask when it changed - the answer isn't what you think!)

LegacyUser

Brett said: Adrian

Whenever really, was it; and/or, has it ever been, a united kingdom!?

Brett

LegacyUser

David Newton said: Three versions of UK actually. United Kingdom of Great Britain was the version from 1707 to 1801.

LegacyUser

Adrian Bruce said: Oh - I think I remember this from before.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom... suggests that while some august sites such as the BBC refer to "the United Kingdom of Great Britain", nonetheless the Acts state:
"That the Two Kingdoms of Scotland and England, shall upon 1 May next ensuing the date hereof, and forever after, be United into One Kingdom by the Name of GREAT BRITAIN." - and that therefore the official name is "Great Britain". (And yes, I checked Article 1 of the English Act)

This may be a bit like the debate over the official title of Ireland - it is the Republic of Ireland, but that's a description - it is a republic, and it is called Ireland. (Or that was what I read). Similarly it was described as a United Kingdom, and it was "Great Britain".

Well, if FS can use "Germany" before 1871, it probably doesn't pay to be too pedantic...

LegacyUser

Robert Joseph Wallace said: FamilySearch could easily accept both United States and United States of America. I just find it annoying that trying to follow a genealogical standard is considered grounds for denying reservations of ordinance work. They as supposed to facilitating ordinance work, not make silly rules to prevent it.

LegacyUser

Gordon Collett said: You can use either one and it won't interfere with ordinance reservations at all. The only thing that interferes with reserving ordinances is having a red exclamation point place name data error like this:



Which means that when you open the editing box shows you will see that no standard has been linked to the displayed name:



You are completely at liberty to standardized the place name like this:



which will display like this:



or to standardize the place name like this:



which will display like this:



Both are entered correctly, both are standardized correctly, and neither has a red exclamation point and so ordinances can be reserved.

(Don't be confused by the map pin icon. It has nothing to do with whether a place name is standardized or not or with ordinances. In fact most full, complete, accurate, standardized place names will never have a map pin.)

LegacyUser

Robert Joseph Wallace said: I have had it reject reservations because it said United States of America, and I also have had ordinances become invalid until I changed it from United States of America to United States.

LegacyUser

Robert Joseph Wallace said: Should have said "previously reserved ordinations become invalid ..." Sorry about that.

LegacyUser

Gordon Collett said: If you ever run into a rejected reservation again that looks like it is because you used United States of America, post the ID here and I'll show you how to fix this without changing the place name.

LegacyUser

Robert Joseph Wallace said: Will do. Thx. And I do appreciate the reply. I have had a hard time getting through in the past.