Suggestion to improve collaboration and document quality of record in Family Tree
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m said: LOL!0
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m said: I would be able to count how many GEDCOM uploads I did...if the filter worked.0
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m said: Joe, have you commented yet on whether or not it is possible to place a warning on FS such as "refuted parents" where users viewing on cellphones, apps, ancestry, home computers, whatever can view it?0
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m said: Joe, have you commented yet on whether or not it is possible to place a warning on FS such as "refuted parents" where users viewing on cellphones, apps, ancestry, home computers, whatever can view it?0
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m said: I hope we haven't given up on the warning. Just yesterday I had to explain an Anjou-like fraud by message. It would be so much simpler for people to see a warning when visiting the person, or see a warning while attempting to add parents "refuted parents are" or while making a wrong merge "often confused with another person."0
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joe martel said: I made a comment about the warnings higher up
"Warning sections. I'd like to see more thought about this. Today the Person's LifeSketch is your billboard, used for warnings. If you were to embed those everywhere then you would end up with the "Disputes" of nFS. It was a UI disaster. So we would need to refine that model and make it so it doesn't become a noisy page of red. THis is a huge additional complexity to the UI and then the next step is to have "my value" - i.e. the assertion model of nFS which had to be replaced - but the open-edit single conclusion model of FT. The werelate and wikitree idea is interesting but the UI is not coherent nor pretty (see below)"
Maybe I missed it but I didn't see a proposal about where this warning is.0 -
Tom Huber said: If you look at most "warnings", they deal with not making changes in some manner. Some simply say do not make any changes to this record with nothing more included. Others go into details about not making any changes until all the notes, discussions, memories and sources have been examined and understood.
So the first thing is what should the "warning" deal with.
In my opinion, it should not be necessary and is seldom effective, even if it is blatantly displayed as part of the Life Sketch.
However, if a warning does exist, it should be dated as to when the warning was made and the user that posted the warning. Posting a warning should automatically turn on the watch for that person for the user.
If the user cancels the watch for that person, then the warning should "go away".
Otherwise, the user should be notified if the warning becomes "stale" (after a year or so has passed) and the user should be required to review and renew or refresh the warning.
If the user does not respond within a reasonable period of time (90 days), then the warning should probably "go away" since the user no longer seems to be involved either with the person or the site.
As to where the warning should appear. My feeling is that it needs to appear as a flag on the person's profile banner linked to the warning. The warning should be on the main profile page and be visible at the top with no way to dismiss/hide/collapse it.0 -
Tom Huber said: m, I use Ancestral Quest and once I have linked an individual to FamilySearch, I can manually synchronize my Ancestral Quest information with the information in the profile that exists in Family Tree. The screen becomes a main work area and I can do just about anything with this person's information stored either within your database or on FamilySearch. All references to "you and your" refer to me as the user. For example, I can:
• View and compare details of your local data and information stored on FamilySearch.
• Upload specific information from your database to FamilySearch and/or download specific information from FamilySearch to your own database.
• View detailed information about facts submitted to FamilySearch, including contributors, Sources and Change History.
• Review and synchronize sources between the person in your file and the person in FamilySearch
• Review and synchronize notes and stories between the person in your file and the person in FamilySearch
• Review and synchronize scrapbook (memories) between the person in your file and the person in FamilySearch
• Synchronize the Parents and Siblings of this Individual on FamilySearch.
• Synchronize the Spouses and Children of this Individual on FamilySearch.
• Unlink the individual in your database from the individual on FamilySearch.
• View the record of this person in Family Tree using your default browser.
• Search for more duplicate individuals on the FamilySearch system.
• Participate in Discussions about the person using the FamilySearch Discussion board.
• View the history of changes to this person in Family Tree, and when appropriate undo changes to the record in Family Tree
• Delete the FamilySearch person, if you were the one who added the record to FamilySearch.
As I mentioned before, Roots Magic and Legacy will have similar capabilities, but I do not know how extensive those two programs are in regard to manually synchronizing the local database record with the FamilySearch.0 -
Tom Huber said: Warnings could include details about the person, such as refuted parents, unknown birth date and place, Not a Revolutionary War soldier, and so on.0
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m said: Where to put the warning. I mentioned previously:
Just yesterday I had to explain an Anjou-like fraud by message to a single person. It would be so much simpler for people to see a warning
1) when visiting the person page, or
2) while attempting to add parents "refuted parents are----" or
3) while making a wrong merge "often confused with another person named ---"
4) while viewing the name/marriage/parents fields...
I'm sure there could be more examples of where.
Take real examples.
Pieter Claessen.
"refuted parents are----" when attempting to add any parents, viewing name field, viewing person page, viewing parent field...0 -
Tom Huber said: Great points, m.
In the case of Pieter (9312-XFX), a Warning could read both "Refuted parents -- Parents Not Known". We need the ability to use limited amounts of html coding in cases like this for emphasis.
That (limited html code) is something that I have wanted (but have not mentioned) for a very long time in a number of text areas on the FamilySearch site. It may be available, but I haven't attempted to use any within the past several years.
Ideally, a warning would be in a box, presented in a font color such as red. Since the word Warning has specific meaning in documentation, we will need some kind of guidance as how and were it can and cannot be used. The use will vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction. In the case of the United States, see https://www.osha.gov/SLTC/etools/pit/....0 -
Tom Huber said: I apologize for bringing up the legal aspects of using various terms, such as "danger", "warning", "caution" and "Notice". We are likely able to use the label "Notice" without regard to any legal issues, but the others all deal with the potential for a physical hazard of some kind.0
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m said: Werelate & Wikitree don't use the word "warning" and I am not recommending "warning" either, I'm recommending "Refuted parents -- -- " or "Person often confused with -- --" stuff like that.0
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m said: See above, I wrote:
"Refuted Parents"
"Disproven Parents"
"Refuted Parent or Parents !"
"Commonly mistaken for another person !"0 -
m said: See above, I wrote:
1) when visiting the person page, or
2) while attempting to add parents "refuted parents are----" or
3) while making a wrong merge "often confused with another person named ---"
4) while viewing the name/marriage/parents fields...
Example. So the other day someone added the parents previously thought to be parents until the baptism was discovered with the real parents. So for that example, some ideas of where to put the warning:
1) when visiting the person page
"refuted parents are -- --"
2) while attempting to add parents
"refuted parents are-- --"0 -
m said: Joe, where the warning is:
See above, I wrote:
1) when visiting the person page, or
2) while attempting to add parents "refuted parents are----" or
3) while making a wrong merge "often confused with another person named ---"
4) while viewing the name/marriage/parents fields...
...and I'm sure there are more locations possible.0 -
m said: I'm hoping to get this question answered on this thread as opposed to starting a another thread since I already have a thread on warnings.0
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Jeff Wiseman said: m, since these recent questions are really all related to suggested improvements related to the handling of warnings, you might want to consider summarizing your key points here over in your other thread on warnings as they will likely get better visibility there.
This subtopic was originally on notes and the documenting of derivation logic from conclusions and how that applies to the original poster's topic on how to specifically improve collaboration and document quality of records in the Family Tree. This subtopic now has deviated a long ways from that.0 -
m said: Actually, it hasn't. I'm going to make a similar thread with my version of ratings for sources. But I was hoping to get an official answer to the "where can FS put a warning" question before I made that thread. To avoid making yet another thread to get that question answered. Too many threads.0
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m said: I just created yet another proof on another page to disprove a myth. A warning could save so much work, you can't imagine.0
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m said: Notes: on NM lines, some have no Notes, some have few Notes. The Notes are mainly : RFN (same person) often twice, age number but no book title or page number and author but no book title (same person), and defunct website that was replaced by a newer website already in the Sources section (same person). Very rarely is it something that is currently useful to someone.0
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m said: Regarding starting a new thread to get an official answer to the "where can FS put a warning":
On this thread I have asked twice and Joe has said he has missed what locations, so then I list the locations and number them, but the question hasn't been answered yet. So rather than making a new thread just to ask a 3rd time, it seems logical to me to just simply ask again on this thread.0 -
joe martel said: I think I was starting to understand.
You would like a "warning" (whatever the word is)- seen when visiting the person page
- seen while attempting to add parents "refuted parents are----"
- seen while making a wrong merge "often confused with another person named ---"
- seen while viewing the name/marriage/parents fields
- It can't be hidden or dismissed
- must have attribution (contributor and date)
- (I took out "..." because there is not way to design and code for that.)
- it would be freeform text where user can whatever text they want like "refuted parents are..."?
- There is only one warning on a Person, not multiple?
- It is editable/deleteable by any user, with appropriate attribution and changelog?
- I thought I was getting it until I saw this "I just created yet another proof on another page to disprove a myth. A warning could save so much work, you can't imagine." Would your proof be the text in the Warning? This seems to conflate the aspect of Notes/Reasons that most this thread is about with a Warning intent. This also starts getting into the gray area with Sources as well.
- That warning would show up for any of the actions that involve that Person? So Adding a child would show the warnings of both parents? How about the siblings? Doing a Merge could show 10's of Warnings that are on each member in the Merge Screen?
- #4 "while viewing name/marriage/parent fields" is confusing to me. In each of the edit dialogs for those or on the main view page?
- In the Cooke example each Person could have a warning. Maybe an affordance could be used to signify a Warning exists and open that up in an overlay? Otherwise showing each warning is going to clutter that page.
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joe martel said: Not sure where to put this warning
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joe martel said: When adding to the family, or Editing relationships each family member could have a Warning so need a way to designate that and to activate an overlay? Or show them all open, somewhere?
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joe martel said: For Merge, you would need more room at the top? And what about for each family member below?
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joe martel said: Person's Family Member layout screen with warnings and do overlay when activating an affordance?
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m said: What is affordance?
How about the little bar yellow black "refuted parents" click to see yellow black and then when click and you see what is entered into the template parents so and so are refuted by his marriage record in which he stated who his parents are.0 -
m said: I just made custom facts Warning his name is so b 1602 and so m to such and such DO NOT MERGE with other person (similar name) b 1639 m to other person---2 different men! with links to Sources and vice versa on the other man.
So this is an example of where you can put a warning.0
This discussion has been closed.