Search>Cemeteries
Answers
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@Tiffany Farnsworth Nash asked ...
What if... it isn't matching to FindaGrave but to BillionGraves instead?
Speculation time again - I don't know about instead but I'm pretty certain that if it isn't matching to BillionGraves now, then I'm guessing it will be doing so in the future. After all, why stop at a fancy front end to FindAGrave when you can add BillionGraves and others under the Search / Cemeteries umbrella?
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I do not think that it is adding through Billion Graves because I have added very few of those. Although they still could I guess.
Old Tennent Churchyard must have just been added!! Hurray!! It was not there yesterday or early this morning!! Maybe the engineers are reading all of this!!🤔😂
But the Graceland Cemetery , Chicago, Cook, Illinois is still not on the Cemetery list. I used Chicago, Cook, Illinois as well as Cook, Illinois as search parameters. Graceland Cemetery is a hard standardization in the Tree!! It has nearly 100K memorials!! KHRL-837, KFBM-4PB
Missing cemeteries under the Cemetery Search. The examples I gave have FG sources and a hard standardization (of the cemetery name) if that is what is being used as the index source. But in the Cemetery search there is no existing cemetery with that name or location!!!!!
Yes, they are in FindaGrave and have individual pages.
For Green-Wood Cemetery, Brooklyn, NY click on Cemeteries to get to the main page - It is under Most Searched US Cemeteries (3rd one over)
I can not really show you my Only Show My relatives because it is tied to my PID
Tomorrow is fine!!
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Sorry, what I mean is that if I look in a cemetery I need a Name to search for instead of a PID. Hope that makes better sense.
Yes, it is strange that each time you mention a cemetery I am then able to find it.
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I haven't taken a lot of time to explore this fun new feature, but here are a couple of things I've noticed.
One thing, is that the Cemetery search does seem to be connected to Find-A-Grave and not the Places database. Here is a location based search in the Cemeteries feature:
Here is roughly the same area in the Places database in which are found the standards that Family Tree Display Place Names are linked to:
Within that circle, the Places database has twelve cemeteries and the Cemeteries list only has three.
I checked a few that are in the Places database but are not on the Cemeteries list and I cannot find those in Find-A-Grave either.
Also, the Places database has just the correct Norwegian names for these cemeteries. The Cemeteries list of names appears to be directly from Find-A-Grave and has the same weird mix of some English and some Norwegian and sometimes using the descriptive term Cemetery and sometimes not so that there are X, X Cemetery, X Church, X Church Cemetery, X Kirke, X Kirkegaard, and X Kirkegård.
I had assumed when I first saw this feature that they had just scanned the entire Family Tree database looking at burial places and created an index of all people with a particular cemetery. Apparently that is not what is going on.
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Making sure I understand correctly; please confirm:
In the first map you went to Cemeteries Search, entered a location, selected a map location, clicked Search button, clicked Map View button.
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I agree, it does appear to be pulling from FindaGrave. See screenshot... It has a link to visit the FindaGrave website.
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I am not familier with the Places database but I should be. How do I find that please?
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Is this the Places Database you referred to?
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Hi Tiffany,
I didn't fully understand your question until I read comments from the Search>Cemetery discussion:
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I just received more clarification on the use of Search/Cemeteries.
Here is the Knowledge Articles on how it works:
and https://www.familysearch.org/en/cemeteries/
All you need to do, is set that cemetery as the burial location for your ancestors that are listed in FamilySearch Family Tree. This is just showing people in FamilySearch Family Tree that have that specific cemetery listed as their burial location. If the cemetery is not standardized, it may not find their ancestors.
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Yes to all your questions. The Places database is the source for all the place names that show up in the various drop down menus as standards which we link entered place names to.
The Places database is a very valuable database where you can see the historical names associated with a single latitude and longitude.
FamilySearch has a couple of web pages that discuss the function, goals, and guidelines for the database and the way place names are entered for various countries:
---- https://www.familysearch.org/en/fieldops/familysearch-places-principles-guidelines
--- https://www.familysearch.org/en/fieldops/fs-places-familysearch-places-country-specific-guidelines
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Mod note: two discussions on the same subject have been merged here.
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Thank you for the info. I have seen that article and I actually posted a link to it on a previous page of this thread. Although I understand how to search using Cemetery Search, several interesting issues have come up regarding 'when/how' people show up in a cemetery search. if you read page 1 of the thread you will see the issues we are trying to understand. Unfortunately the article doesn't address these questions. In short, sometimes people don't show up in Cemeteries Search when we think they should and sometimes vice versa.
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Thanks for the great info on the Places Database. I'll do some reading tomorrow!
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Back to missing cemeteries??? An update! I went into Cemeteries searched by location: Chicago, Cook, Illinois, USA; click search. Full list of cemeteries for Chicago, with the exception of Graceland Cemetery! Still not in main list.
Went back did a search using the name: Graceland Cemetery - several choices come up and surprisingly one for Chicago, Cook, Illinois.
I chose that one: My ggrandfather KFBM-4PB is not in the list (his burial info has been Entered since 2022. His wife KHRL-837 burial info as well. She is not in the Graceland list either .
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1) I went to Cemetery Search and entered the location: Chicago, Cook, Illinois, United States (note that USA wasn't accepted0. It worked for me so not sure why it wouldn't work for you @Rue Snell.
2) I entered Graceland Cemetery which also came up. I selected it.
3) I looked up the PID to find his name and saw that it was indeed added 8 Aug 2022.
4) I typed in his last name 'Burr' - he does not show in this cemetery. I also tried his first name - no joy. I have no idea why he wouldn't show up in this cemetery. @Linda Thurson Galloway can you please help us figure out why?
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The first search I only went to place Chicago, Cook, Illinois to bring up the whole list of Chicago cemeteries. From that list there is no Graceland.
The 2nd search I changed the search to Graceland Cemetery. That search produces Graceland Cemetery's everywhere and one choice was the one in Chicago!
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Re: 1st search. Please tell me how your search differs from my first picture? I am not seeing how my search is different from yours. Graceland showed up for me. Just trying to figure out...
Re: 2nd search. That should correlate with my 2nd picture.
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Just as a minor detail, I have convinced myself that Search / Cemeteries has had at least one interface run from the BillionGraves data.
My 3G-GF, Samuel Pickstock, LKJT-2NL, appears in Search / Cemeteries under Middlewich Cemetery, Middlewich, Cheshire, England, United Kingdom.
His FamilyTree profile shows a burial event that is standardised as Middlewich, Cheshire, England, United Kingdom. In other words, he could be buried anywhere in the town of Middlewich. (I presumably entered that data long before Standard Placenames for Cemeteries were a thing.)
His burial event shows a Display Name of Middlewich Cemetery Middlewich, Cheshire, England, but I am assuming that the interface doesn't look at the Display Name - it's surely way too risky to use the Display version.
There is no FindAGrave Source attached to Samuel (he's not even in the FindAGrave site).
There is a "BillionGraves Index" source attached to his profile. The attached values from the Source are:
- Name Samuel Pickstock
- Death Date 03 Oct 1903
- Event Type Burial
- Event Place Middlewich, Cheshire, England, United Kingdom
- Longitude -2.45245
- Latitude 53.19418
- Cemetery Middlewich Cemetery
Notice that "Cemetery" item - I am convinced that is part of the story about how the link is made to Search / Cemeteries, but that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.
So here's one example of how data must(?) have come from the BillionGraves index. But I'm sure that there's more to it than just attaching a BG or FG source that happens to have a Cemetery sub-item in that source in question, as I've done exactly that for another relative who is in the FG Collection and they have not appeared in Search / Cemeteries. Maybe the interface from the BG or FG indexes into Search / Cemeteries is only run occasionally or is not run for the full amount of data?
Somebody knows - but does FamilySearch know?
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Very interesting! Thanks for reporting that. I suspect that AI is involved.
Have you checked your person that you added to Cemetery Search to see if they showed up in FindaGrave yet? The re-indexing could take weeks though.
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To answer your first question: Chicago, Cook Illinois comes up in the search bar YES and if you select it and click the blue search button and scroll down to the list of cemeteries that appears - Graceland is not in that list.
If you change the place to Cook County, Illinois with same above search Graceland is not listed either. What's weird is this search brings up Indiana cemeteries!!
And like you searched for Graceland Cemetery - it brings up several across the US and mine is there but like you found neither of my Burr's are there. The mystery continues!!
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I think I understand what the difference in question #1 is. I think you are entering "Cook County, Illinois" in the 'Location or Cemetery' field and then selecting the first option which is for the map. I was scrolling down the list and finding 'Graceland Cemetery'. Here is what I think you were selecting (highlighted gray).
I can confirm again that your POI (person of interest) does not appear there. He should because the FindaGrave source is attached and the Cemetery is 'hard' standardized in the Burial Event.
So we know now exactly what/how you searched and I have been able to duplicate the results.
Now all we need is a Tech to explain how this is happening.
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I was also able to recreate your "If you change the place to Cook County, Illinois with same above search Graceland is not listed either. What's weird is this search brings up Indiana cemeteries!!"
Now all we need is a Tech to explain how this is happening too!
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I was selecting the Chicago, Cook, Illinois as you illustrated but then clicked on the "Search button" on the far right after the Full Name field not the map!! This gives you a list of cemeteries in boxes like your 2nd example. Neither shows Graceland.
Thanks for all your help! When you hear back from Tech please let me know how it goes!!
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I followed the same steps you did with Walter Delano Burr and got the same results.
To report an issue: While in the Search / Cemeteries, press the Feedback button
Click on Generic feedback - Choose an emoji - and then enter all of the information & screenshots to show what is not working. There is an option to leave your email if you want.
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When I enter "Chicago, Cook, Illinois" in the 'Location or Cemetery' field it opens a scrolling list to choose from, however, it does not allow me to click the 'Search' button, it remains grayed out. Hmm... what am I missing here?
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I am not sure!
As soon as I choose Chicago, Cook, Illinois, USA from the scrolling place list my search button turns from gray to blue!! When it turns blue I click it and it gives me four columns of boxes with cemetery names & locations in them.
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Hmm... I am a Mac using Safari Browser (Yes, I know it isn't really supported but I won't switch so there's that).
Are you a PC? What browser are you using? Your phone?
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(I am also using Safari and always have. It is fully supported in, as with other browsers, the current version and the previous one. That would be Safari 16 and 17. See: https://www.familysearch.org/en/help/helpcenter/article/which-internet-browsers-are-compatible . If you are running into problems using Safari 16 or 17, those need to be reported so they can be fixed.)
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