Regarding Italian names-can they begin with a "J"?
I am looking at batch MS5Z-KW4 from Catanzaro, Italy in the early 1800s. Italian doesn't usually employ a "J" (at least nowadays).
I have seen spelling of surname two different ways in the genealogy and family trees. Unfortunately, I think , that the name Iacono and Jacono are the same family in this example. The problem is that a search for Jacono or Iacono does NOT bring up the other members of this family I believe.
So, was a "J" used in the early 1800s? Also, is there a way during research that the site can bring up both "Iacono" and "Jacono" if either surname are entered?
Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Dave
Answers
-
A question mark can be used as a wild card for a single letter: ?acono will return both spellings.
1 -
In many handwriting styles, there's no difference between capital i and capital j.
Modern Italian uses i for both [i] (/ee/ as in "meek") and [j] (/y/ as in "yellow"), but older rules specified j in some contexts (such as in diphthongs and vowel groups), and older rules are often fossilized in names. It can therefore be basically impossible to tell whether a handwritten record says Jacono or Iacono.
(You could say that the answer to the "or" question is actually "yes": modern Italian has gone back a millennium or two to when i and j were slightly different ways to form the same letter, just like how nowadays, some people put a crossbar at the top of the capital J, and some people don't.)
As Áine said, for searches you can use the question mark as a wildcard standing for any single letter. For indexing, you'll just have to make a decision on how to interpret the writing. Likewise, if you're working on a family with this name, you'll need to decide how to interpret each record and which one to give priority. I figure that you can use the modern spelling rules as a tiebreaker.
2 -
Good morning,
thank you both. Your responses clarified the issue.
Too bad we can’t add a note to other people who are doing their own family ancestry searches that they should (1) post a question mark in their inquiries or (2) to use both a J or an I in the search.
I have seen both spellings when I’ve looked at Calabrian trees.
Thanks again
Dave
0 -
When indexing and reviewing batches of records, our purpose is to transcribe what is written on the record, in other words, type what we see.
0 -
Yes, but the point is, "type what you see" is a judgement call: if the first letter could be an I or J, which one do you type? Do you go by modern rules and type an I, or do you take old rules into account that say it could be a J?
1 -
In the project instructions I think it covers this situation. It says to use the 'J" and not use the modern "I". I haven't run into any last names that have started with a J/I, yet, most have been in the middle like Majello/Maiello. So then by that rule everyone would be indexing it the same and I guess they just have to be aware of Italian long J transitioned into I somewhere along the time line. I would think, hopefully, FamilySearch will use this information and enter it into the algorithm when searching Italian records. So that it pulls up records/people no matter if they typed J or I.
0 -
Hello,
Thanks to everyone and hopefully the algorithm catches this interchange.
For those of you interested in some “archeology”, so in researching a little more, I’ve seen several examples in which a letter we would identify as a J or j, is actually an i.
I base this observation on Italian words such as “Febbrajo” and “calzolajo” . Both are common Italian words for February (febbraio) and calzolaio (cobbler, shoemaker).
So, I would venture that the “j”that we recognize is actually an “i”. The J sound is made by “gi” in Italian. There is no need for a j therefore.
this whole matter seems to be an orthography point. I’ve seen a letter that looks like an “h” in records but is actually an “n” in records even if not part of a name. I guess there’s a lot of challenges in reading old records!
0
