Use of Family Photographs
I have uploaded some family photographs to galleries and use them as portraits to help visualise individuals. I have recently looked at another commercial genealogy product as a way of finding a wider range of DNA matches.
I was surprised to find that in their "suggested match" feature they have access to my family photos. I have uploaded similar photos to another commercial website so I am not 100% sure that they obtained the photos from FamilySearch but FamilySearch trademark is shown when displaying the suggested matches and images.
So does FamilySearch sell your information to commercial companies ?
I know that adding images gives access to all other users, but sharing them with another company that is then selling them for profit ?
I contribute my time and information on the principle of building something for open community use, not to be locked away behind a paywall for someone else's profit.
Best Answer
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@ChrisPyne ChrisPyne
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Chris
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Apart from the 'fine print' ( legal 'mumbo jumbo' ) in the ...
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Privacy Notice
https://www.familysearch.org/legal/privacy
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FamilySearch Terms of Use
https://www.familysearch.org/legal/terms
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FamilySearch Content Submission Agreement
https://www.familysearch.org/legal/familysearch-content-submission-agreement
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FYI
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There is are also these (... simplified ...) "Knowledge Articles" in 'FamilySearch':
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Can I add memories about my living relatives to Family Tree?
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Where it states:
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Protect privacy of living people by making memories private
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Please do not submit photographs of living except your own minor children, without their consent. Please see our Submission Agreement for more information.
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If you submit photographs of living people, we recommend that you make them private.
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If you do not make the memory private, it can be shared through linking, social media, and e-mail. It is also potentially findable using Google. The memory can be found through a topic tag search and may be findable in more ways in the future. Making a memory private prevents all of this from happening.
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And ...
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Who can view the items uploaded in Memories for living people?
https://www.familysearch.org/help/helpcenter/article/who-can-view-the-items-uploaded-to-memories
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Where id states:
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Before you share any memories about living people, you should understand that all memories—even those with living people in them—are publicly viewable and potentially findable:
- They can be shared through linking, social media, and e-mail.
- They can be found through a topic tag search in FamilySearch Memories.
- They may be found using Google and other search engines.
In the future, memories may be findable in even more ways. Please see our Submission Agreement before adding memories to FamilySearch.
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Tag names
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If a tag is attached to a living person in Family Tree, the tag is shown only to users who can see that living person in Family Tree. If, however, the tag contains the name of a living person, but the tag is not attached to that living person in Family Tree, then the tag is visible to everyone who sees the memory.
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Albums
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If you have an album that contains memories about both living and deceased people, anyone who finds any memory in that album can navigate and discover all the other memories in that album. Other users can also add memories you upload to an album they create.
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Just some additional info ...
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Brett
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ps:
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Unfortunately, MOST Users/Patrons DO NOT really read (or, even, understand) the 'fine print' ( legal 'mumbo jumbo' ); BEFORE, embarking on using ANY "System", let alone, 'FamilySearch' (and, the various Parts thereof; including, especially, "Family Tree"; or, the "Genealogies" Part),
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Such is life ...
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Answers
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Yes, I have read the small print. FamilySearch can do whatever they want with any content that you submit. So I have deleted all of my family photographs.
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can you clarify what the other genealogy product is?
I doubt FS is selling access - I imagine the other company is simply accessing what is publicly available on the Internet. (which explains why the other company is showing the FS trademark - indicating that they are freely available) on FS.
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Also Family Search does have various relationships with other companies - where those companies share info with FamilySearch - so that FamilySearch can show what records those other companies have (such as Findagrave / Find My Past and others ) - which makes Familysearch results more comprehensive - and FamilySearch also does share certain things with these other companies. BUT I have no reason to believe FS is making a profit off of selling access to what is freely available. [click expand post]
also note - ANYONE on the Internet can access a photo uploaded to FS
example: https://www.familysearch.org/photos/artifacts/67223041?cid=mem_copy
(test that without being logged on to FS and you will see you can still access it)
FS doesnt claim exclusive rights on these image,
and if people can access so easily - so can companies - even for profit companies.
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Yes, it is MyHeritage.com. That is some pretty sophisticated website scraping to extract all my family information, including photos from a Google search and then reformat it into a feature within their website. Maybe FS policy of having information accessible by a Google search is being exploited but no longer with my photos.
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Thanks Brett.
I knew I was making the photos available to other users of FS and I only did it for deceased individuals. Their image is another piece of information similar to the factual information that we all seek out and collate, to build into their life histories. I perhaps naively thought I was working within an open access and collaborative community. I just did not expect and was quite shocked to find my efforts at building my ancestors life histories to be on sale for £189 per year annual subscription.
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Yes, I welcome the increasing trend among providers to form relationships in order to share their digitised content across their subscribers. It does not make economic sense for all companies to try to digitise every source and the consumer does have to pay for the cost of digitisation, so sharing information is a better deal for users . I asked the question and the unofficial feedback so far is that FS does not sell the collated work of its community. I accept that. But someone is taking this free and accessible information, that we all work together to create , making it their property and charging you a fee to access it. Is that proper? In the several links kindly provided by Brett, the FamilySearch Terms & Usage would seem to prevent commercial usage of FS content without permission. So do MyHeritage have permission to sell the FS content that we create ?
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One company taking freely accessible items from the Internet - and charging for it - is not against the law.
if anyone is willing to pay for it - when it is freely accessible at another location - then thats their choice.
it may not be very popular and ethical - but its definitely not against the law.
Note that the "content" referred to in the "terms of use" - is NOT referring to the uploaded items from inividual users. I have specifically asked that myself of FamilySearch. (They dont own the rights to such items in the first place - and if anyone had a copyright on such items - they are not giving up such copyright to FS)
and much of the material in question is "public domain" items anyway - old photos, names, dates relationships, facts - that dont have a copyight.
I understand your concerns. BUT from a legal perspective - there is not much to prevent a company from taking something that is freely available - and charging for it. if people are willing to pay . . .
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Also the analysis becomes complicated when you consider the following
lets say MyHeritage - charges X dollars for their services at a given point in time
and lets say at that point in time - all of what they provide was generated totally by their company alone.
THEN at some point later in time - MyHeritage all of a sudden is shared some genealogical information from FamilySearch
and they post that in their website.
BUT if they still charge X dollars as they did before -
are they really profiting off of what they got from FamilySearch???
its not as cut and dry as we sometimes perceive it.
just because MyHertitage and others are "for profit" companies
and even if they obtain info that came (freely) from FamilySearch
in my eyes - doesnt always really mean they are profiting from info that was always meant o be free.
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Thanks for the legal clarification. I am certainly not paying to read the content that I have created on FS. I cant wait for the sales rep to do his call back and ask if I need a further discount off the full price, in order to get my credit card number !!
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exactly - I agree - no one in their right mind is going to pay more.
but - did MyHeritage all of a sudden raise their rates - when they started showing FS content??
I doubt it. so in my mind I dont care if they have my content.
BTW - does MyHeritage have any of what they call "free content" - items that they specifically state are free and not covered by the service charge they charge?
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also just just keep in mind - even if we have spent decades gathering our family tree data
the vast majority of it - is not covered by copy right or other exclusive rights
Gathered facts - no matter how large the collection - is not copyrightable. (names, dates, places, relationships - stored in a database)
and the majority of old family photos and documents are in the public domain anyway. (just because we own something or even have made a scan of the item - does NOT mean we have copyright).
also any transcription of an item - does not transfer the copyright of such item to the transcriber.
only that portion that is original and creative - does the creator have copyright on.
In summary - the vast majority of what we think is "our genealogy"
is really public domain info.
Here are some great links that deal with copyright and genealogy.
http://yanceyfamilygenealogy.org/copyright.htm
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. . . . and just for the record . . . I am not a FS employee nor really trying to "defend them"
just sharing what I have learned over the years
especially as much of it relates to a project I am involved with - Family Bible Preservation Project
to which much of our discussion also applies
http://yanceyfamilygenealogy.org/family_bible_chasers.htm
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If you are into family Bible preservation, and don't already know about this....there are a bunch of family Bibles being sold on Etsy, and some also on Ebay. Kind of sad ...kind of neat that I might someday find my family's Bible.
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yes - well aware
see these links:
https://community.familysearch.org/s/feed/0D53A00004tUJXfSAO
https://community.familysearch.org/s/group/0F93A0000009XyzSAE/family-bibles
also see The Family Bible Index with over 300,000 entries
http://yanceyfamilygenealogy.org/family_bible_index.htm
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The 300,000 entry Family Bible Index - for example looks like a massive amount of work and data - but it is merely a collection of data and facts - and I cannot claim copyright on such data - though I can claim copyright on "my presentation" of it
http://yanceyfamilygenealogy.org/family_bible_index.htm
(Clarification: "Dennis J Yancey" - and "Family Bibles" users are one and the same user - just different account - sorry for the confusion)
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I do not know the history of MyHeritage services. I have only just joined. They accept your DNA file for free and then charge £35 in order for you to see details of your DNA matches and to have facilities to contact them. Plus some interesting DNA tools. I paid for that because that is the service I need and it has already generated half a dozen confirmed DNA cousins that curiously do not show on AncestryDNA even though so far both parties have initially tested with Ancestry ? But it is working and worth it.
You can upload your GEDCOM file for free and do manual changes to it. All searches immediately trigger the paywall so there is no opportunity to examine what sources they have and general usefulness of that data. Their most powerful and premium feature is Instant Discovery (TM) which has a preview capability. So you have an overview of whole family subsets that you could add to your tree and it is credited to FamilySearch but you cannot add them. But it was the photos and proposed family structures that immediately gave it away as being copied for FS. It only works for me because the uploaded GEDCOM file is so far behind my latest research on FS.
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