Why is a record I have posted no longer available
I have a baptism, via Ancestry, of an England Select record that is no longer showing on Ancestry or Family Search. Why is this?
Best Answer
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Gillian
Welcome to the "Community.FamilySearch" Forum.
I am just another 'lowly' User/Patron ...
You are not alone ...
It has happened to most of us, at some stage or another ...
Short Answer: Records come and go ...
The whole problem/issue is, that Records (ie. both, Indexing; and/or, Image), can both, come and go, in 'FamilySearch', at ANY time.
The reason why Records (ie. both, Indexing; and/or, Image), can both, come and go, in 'FamilySearch', are varied. There are many reasons; but, always remember, it is ultimately the Record "Custodian" who dictates, whether or not, Records (ie. both, Indexing; and/or, Image), will/can be available in "FamilySearch'; and, that includes, even, at a later date - circumstances and situations "Change".
All the "Records", that we 'see' in 'FamilySearch', are subject to MANY (and, various) "Contractual Agreements/Arrangements" between, 'FamilySearch'; and, the MANY (and, various) Record "Custodians".
These "Contractual Agreements/Arrangements" are, of course, subject to, "Review"; and, "Renewal".
[ And, sometimes, "Change" WITHOUT "Notice" ... ]
Record "Custodians", hold ALL the power, with regards to, the "Contractual Agreements/Arrangements".
'FamilySearch' simply tries to negotiate, the best 'outcome', for Users/Patrons. of 'FamilySearch'.
[ ie. to be able to view/access the various "Records" for FREE, through 'FamilySearch' ... ]
Like it or not ...
Nothing is set in stone ...
Best advice ... "Download" a "Copy" of the "Image", if available/allowed; and, retain for your research.
Here is a "Knowledge Article" in 'FamilySearch':
Why did some historical records disappear from FamilySearch?
And ...
Here are a couple of other "Knowledge Article" in 'FamilySearch':
Why are there access limitations on Historical Records?
What are the image restrictions in Historical Records?
Plus ...
I am sure, that the same thing happens, with the many OTHER "Commercial" Websites (eg. including: "Ancestry_com"); especially, if the Record "Custodian", decides to 'pulls the pin', so to speak ...
I know that this certainly does not help/assists; but, I hope that this gives you some, insight; and, perspective.
Brett
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Answers
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@Gillian Leavesley_1 You've not given us very much to work with.
"I have a baptism, via Ancestry" presumably, you have created a source referring to an Ancestry record.
"of an England Select record" presumably, the Ancestry record refers to this.
"longer showing on Ancestry" In that case, it won't show up on Family Search either.
Perhaps you would get an answer from the organisation which holds the source, but If you can no longer locate the record, then you'll have difficulty informing them what it was. This is why I always keep text notes of every record in my own files. Sorry I couldn't do more, but without information I'm just biomass.
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It is a simple matter, I would have thought. A record that was an Family Search is no longer there. I would appreciate an understanding of why this should be. This same record has also disappeared from Ancestry searches. As the record is from England Select, I would have thought Family Search would be the source holder. I have all my records on my laptop on Family Tree Maker. I can still see the record on Ancestry when I click on it but it is no longer available by searching in either Ancestry or Family Search
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Thank you Brett for a clear and friendly reply. I Sync to FTM from Ancestry so always have a copy of every record, not that there is much to see on the IGI ones.
Best Wishes
Gill
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I do not understand about "Records Custodians" because I THOUGHT familysearch.org WAS the records custodian or that the LDS church was, and I understood that familysearch.org DID belong to the LDS? Who owns familysearch if LDS does not? It seems that the GOVERNMENT would own the Census Records and would allow us to see the Census Records since our taxes paid for the gathering of census information? Custodian, it seems, would MEAN owner? Owner would be Government wouldn't it? And I UNDERSTOOD that the LDS had methodically copied the Census Records all through the years after the Church began? Who would we appeal to since the copies we had APPEARED to come from familysearch.org.
Charlene [email protected]
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Charlene
Please be, advised; and, aware ...
That 'FamilySearch', is SIMPLY the "Facilitator"; and, NOT, a "Record Custodian" ...
'FamilySearch' (originally, the "Genealogical Society of Utah"), is part of...
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints
[ Often, referred to as, "LDS"; or, Mormons", for short; but, the FULL Name is preferred ... ]
Of course, obviously, the The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, is the Record "Custodian", for its OWN Church records; but, that is it ...
'FamilySearch' (ie. the Church) assists ALL around the World, with the preservation of "Records".
Where possible, 'FamilySearch' (ie. the Church), also tries to obtain "Copies" of those "Records"; and, when, it does obtain a "Copy", those "Records", are stored in a facility of the church, in the Mountains near Salt Lake City, Utah, USA - know; as, the "Granite Mountain Vault".
Having a "Copy", of those "Records", DOES NOT make, 'FamilySearch' (ie. the Church), the Record "Custodian" of those records.
'FamilySearch' (ie. the Church), is ONLY acting, an additional "Repository", from those "Records" - nothing more, nothing less.
Likewise, 'FamilySearch' (ie. the Church), DOES NOT have any real "Right" with regard to such records.
'FamilySearch' (ie. the Church), can ONLY follow the, wishes; and, DIRECTION, of the OFFICIAL Record "Custodian" (of, which there are MANY), of ANY, of those records, that it hold in its repository.
Those wishes; and, DIRECTION, of the OFFICIAL Record "Custodian" (of, which there are MANY), of ANY, of those records, are the predicated upon; and, take the form of, by/through those "Contractual Agreements/Arrangements", between, 'FamilySearch'; and, the MANY (and, various) Record "Custodians".
Now ...
That Said ...
'FamilySearch' (ie. the Church), TRIES to make as MANY as the "Records", that it holds, available to ALL (well, as may as it possibly can); BUT, unfortunately, that is NOT always possible, due to the "Contractual Agreements/Arrangements", between, 'FamilySearch'; and, the MANY (and, various) Record "Custodians".
Just my thoughts.
Again ...
IF, you have not already, THEN, please read there articles ...
Here are some "Knowledge Articles", in 'FamilySearch':
Why are there access limitations on Historical Records?
Why do some indexes have access limitations?
https://www.familysearch.org/en/help/helpcenter/article/why-are-some-indexes-restricted
What are the image restrictions in Historical Records?
Why did some historical records disappear from FamilySearch?
I know, that this certainly may not help/assists; but, I hope, that this gives you some additional, insight; and, perspective.
Brett
[ And, 'Yes', I also happen to be, a Member of the Church ... ]
ps: 'FamilySearch' (ie. the Church), can only do what it can ...
pps: And, sometimes, more, often, than not, there are "Systems" problems/issues, that need ...
...... Addressing/Fixing - which, FIRSTLY, needs to be identified; &, SECONDLY, dealt with - it all takes TIME
.
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Charlene
Furthermore ...
Just for some 'light' reading ...
From, the Church website ...
Granite Mountain Records Vault
https://news-au.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/granite-mountain-records-vault
From, the 'FamilySearch' website ...
Granite Mountain Records Vault
https://www.familysearch.org/records/archives/web/about-granite-mountain/
From, "WikiPedia" ...
Granite Mountain (Salt Lake County, Utah)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granite_Mountain_(Salt_Lake_County,_Utah)
Brett
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"It seems that the GOVERNMENT would own the Census Records and would allow us to see the Census Records since our taxes paid for the gathering of census information?"
US Federal Census records are free to view (both indexes and images) on FamilySearch. There's a contract between the National Archives (NARA)- the record custodian - and FamilySearch that guarantees this. However there are many government-created records that are not free to view (e.g. records relating to immigrants and new citizens of the US).
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