Clarification on two records for Agate Marin Jakobsdatter and or Agnete Marie Jakobsdatter

anneelizabethlund1

Clarification on two records for Agate Marin Jakobsdatter and or Agnete Marie Jakobsdatter

In family search Norm Baker found a list of 12 children born to Jakob Olaus Petersen and Tomasine Marthe Emenualsdatter. There are two daughters with similar names and similar birth dates in this list.

Agate Marin 15 March 1843, and Agnete Marie 19 March 1843. https://www.familysearch.org/search/record/results?q.birthLikeDate.from=1840&q.birthLikeDate.to=1870&q.fatherGivenName=jakob&q.fatherSurname=petersen&q.motherGivenName=thomasine&q.motherSurname=emmanuelsdatter&f.recordCountry=Norway&f.recordSubcountry=Norway%2CMøre%20og%20Romsdal&offset=0&m.defaultFacets=on&m.queryRequireDefault=on&m.facetNestCollectionInCategory=on&count=20

So far I have found two records an official record entry #19

https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/2256/14247/19

and a copy entry #13

https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/16014/91773/9

The Information in both records seems to be the same although the copy has some extra information in the Christening date, and child’s name boxes. I can see how the extraction could have 19 March instead of 15 March like the original, and with close comparison of the scribes handwriting on another entry I can tell the actual date on the copy is the 15th instead of 19th. My question is the FS record shows the Christening date of 16 April for Agate and 22 March for Agnete. Is there any evidence of the Christening date difference with the name difference in these two records?

 And which if they are the same which name should I record in FS?

anneelizabethlund1

I also found an official confirmation record entry #11

https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/2258/14273/4

and a copy confirmation record also entry #11

https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/16017/91791/8

The names again are similar, the copy being scratched through and corrected in both birth and confirmation records, as well as a goofy birthdate in the copy confirmation record. So could it be that Agate/Agathe - official and

Agnete - copy are the same person, and she was born 15 March 1843 not the 19th? And why does it have different Christening dates on the official birth and copy birth? Or are they actually the same? I just don’t understand where the extraction on FS has her Christening date as 22 March 1843.

Norm Baker

Hello again,

This is a really good exercise for trying to figure out what is going on and again confirms that you always try to find the original records and don't rely 100% on an indexed record!

 

These are the same person and not different ones.

 

First of all, let's fix the name. Her middle name is Marie or Maria. I know it looks like Marin in most of the records, but what looks to us like an "n" on the end of her name is actually a gothic "e". On the copy of the confirmation record, the middle name of the girl above Agnete Marie is "Oline". If you compare the last letter in "Oline" to the last letter in "Marie", they are exactly the same. So that has to be an "e". In the official record of the confirmation, her name is Agathe Maria. Since all spelling was phonetic, and since Maria and Marie are pronounced exactly the same (in Scandinavia), they are the same name.

 

Now her first name. It looks to me like the writer of the official record and the writer of the copy, couldn't quite agree on the first name. The official baptism record has her name as Agate Marie. The official confirmation record has her name as Agathe Maria. Again, both names would be pronounced the same way-the "h" in Agathe would not be pronounced (much like we do not pronounce the "h" in Thomas. The copy of the birth record has Agate Agnete Marie and the copy of the confirmation record has Agathe Agnete Marie. At least the clerk was consistent!

 

As far as what to put into Family Search Tree, if it were me, I would put her name as Agate or Agathe Marie and put the other name, Agnete Marie, in "Other Information" as an alternate name. As far as the 15/13 43 birth date on the confirmation copy, just chalk that up to human error. All of the other dates for her birth are 15 March, 1843. And both birth records have the christening date as 16 April, 1843. I am not sure where the 22 March date came from-there weren't any christenings in the parish on that date. More human error, I suppose.

Norm Baker

As soon as I clicked "Answer" I thought, "Maybe there is another copy that explains the 22 March christening date." Sure enough, there is one. It is the Curates's copy and is right here (entry 41): https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/2302/109 . On the far right, it says she was "home baptized" on the 22nd of March by Emanuel (?) Slettebak.

anneelizabethlund1

Well perhaps she was sick when she was born, being her mother’s first born child and March in mid-high latitude Norway. They may have been worried about her and Christened her quickly at home, then when she survived they did it again in the Church. I’m so happy you found this information for me. I’ll have to try and figure out how to find curators records too. I really like the name Agate, it looks like a precious stone, yet is pronounced in Norwegian similar to Agatha with a softer “a” at the end and softer “t” it sounds pretty! I think I’ll keep it that way. Change her middle name and add all the sources and alternate spellings.

Thanks again, so very much. I’m having fun finding my Grandfather’s Uncle and Aunt and their family. Now I’m working on his Grandparents family with Agate Marie being the first child. Someone in Family Search put <1860> as their marriage date, probably because it was one year before Karoline, my Great-grandmother’s birthday. But I couldn’t find a marriage record for them in 1860. I did find an 1842 record but that seemed too far away from Karoline, but now that I’m finding all these kids with your help, the 1842 marriage of Jakob Olaus Peterson and Tomasine Marie Emenuelsdatter makes sense. https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/2256/78 My sister thought they were unmarried when they had Karoline because she couldn’t find the record. Although the word Piga is not associated with Tomasine in Karoline’s birth record. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VW2W-65P

Now I’ll find the official record for Karoline’s birth.

So her older sister Agate was christened at home and her Grandfather Emenuel was witness. This is awesome information, thanks.

I really appreciate your help and support in this amazing search for family history!

anneelizabethlund1

Oh, and Agate/Agnete may have been named for her Grandmother Hette Agnete. 🤔

anneelizabethlund1

Thanks again for this help. It really clarified things for me, so that I could do the needed merges of possible duplicates. It's also fun to see information on my ancestors stories.

Norm Baker

You are very welcome! I agree that this work is enjoyable.