I am looking for information on my Grandmother Irma Maria Van Hulle 12-November 1877- 24 March 1915,
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Carefull with sharing info about your home place , and not being home,or on a
different location;keep in mind , these fora are public domain,and everyone can read along.Not all people are reliable.
Still searching for Camiel.Mail came back from Felixarchief, they say they do not store passengers lists.They told me of two other possible locations.
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Request for Mr Juengling
I was able to locate a passenger ship list - Amerika/Canada -covering the period Margaret's Father came to Canada.Apparently there is a book on the shelves of your servers; but only the link/numbers/indexes are availiable.I cannot acces it; but the location should be this.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/catalog/results?count=20&query=+subject_id:343453
I can find the book in Worldcat, but at most hubs availiable,it is a paying service only(expensive), and i do not have the warranty Margarets father is in it.would it be possible to unlock it to read or is it not indexed/digitised?
I leave it at your discretion.
Kind regards , Adrie
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I am having a geneology class this afternoon, after my painting workshop....so will keep working on this. Thank-You I love painting portraits, my Dad painted scenes and mostly horses, and Uncle Hilaire painted for a living.
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No results found due to not digitalized yet.
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I did an extensive search on Camiel,to find out he is nowhere to be found around
his year of birth.(1872), it should be that year because as he presents Leon at his birth
in 1904- he states that he is 31 yrs old on the cert.
Found out he should be searched at the Oostwinkel -catalogue.Only found fragments of that,so needed to contact an expert.(from Assenede),he told me that Oostwinkel back
then was written as,' Oostwynckel'.... This was correct.
I found Oostwynckel then , but the books are very badly composed, indexes are not at the supposed locations etc,.. and it is a very big volume containing more than 1000 pages.
As i did not find 1872 after some time, i decided to give that squirrel some rest.But it ain't over yet.
Some other reasearch i'v done.
Roughly located the volume's of immigrationrelated books from St Johns, in wich you probably found Omer Matthys.it is a very big container.Everything in it is a hashed
stack of vesseldata.I will try to sort it out somehow.
Investigated the Mestdaghs from Manitoba, to find out they were present in Canada long before your fathers arrival.Many of them were indeed potato farmers before
emigration.
Investigated Ro and location.
see google streetview = Rostraat at the prompt.You can ride it if zooming in to street level.You can do the same in Langestraat btw.
Have to go now, maybe back this evening.
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WOW! Thank-You
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See-picture Noordstraat black & white.The one with the Stairs and the painter in front.
I took two snips of the site of Marianne Posman.I do not know her.I never contacted her, but as her infotainment site about
Maldegem and surroundings is very substantial,in-depth, and wide spectrum at the same time, many genealogists take snips
from it, without her knowing.It is used as a source often,keep in mind, this is not science.
Back to the snips.
One of it is a piece of text she writes about the Noordstraat in Maldegem.A picture about the Noordstraat , nr 78 is used.
as a witness in time, probably an old postcard?..
Posman names all persons on the picture , their occupations and other components in the picture, and also names the locations and
owners of the houses to the left and to the right.
This is the text that belongs to the picture, but was splitted in an unhandy way, with another picture in between.
I took the liberty to stich it together like it was meant to be.(only reformatted txt).
Op de oude prentkaart, daterend van 1909, links staat David Savat (1875) met een stapel brood in de linkerhand, in het midden staat met de hoed op, buurman Emiel Spiegelaere (15 juni 1878), schrijnwerker - timmerman en echtgenoot van Emma Vincke (1877), een modiste, die in het huis woonde rechts met het uithangbord, nummer 72. Op het voetpad met witte schort staat de huisschilder Pieter De Baets die een gevel aan ’t schilderen was waar de ladder staat aan de rechterkant. Pieter De Baets (25 09 1884) was de vader van Raphaël De Baets. Pieter De Baets woonde met zijn gezin in de Stationsstraat 38, schuin over de vroegere CERA bank. Zijn zoon Raphaël De Baets woonde aanvankelijk in het huis naast het voormalige kaaswinkeltje, ’t Hoeveke, waar jarenlang Kapper Meneve een zaak uitbaatte. Raphaël De Baets en zijn echtgenote Angèle Timmerman startten een handelszaak in verf en behang rechtover het Jeugdhuis in een brede woning dat eigendom was van de tantes van Raphaël, Cordula en Emma De Baets die er een herberg hadden, Café Congo in nummer 52. Nu is dat de leegstaande voormalige Leonidas pralinen winkel. Angèle Timmerman was de zus van Theophiel, dus een tante van de gekende Louis Timmerman.
Naast het huis van Emiel Spiegelaere was ooit de woning van Dierenarts Henri Van der Donckt (1879) en Maria Cuelenaere. Dit huis werd verkocht aan Alice Cauwels. Kapper Carlos De Brée - Decostere kocht deze woning en startte Parfumerie Penelope. Toen deze handelszaak verhuisde naar de Markstraat heeft Leen Van den Driessche, de dochter van de handelsreiziger Jules Van den Driessche (1923) en Paula Spelier (1922) er een wol boetiek Berger DU NORD opengehouden. Het is nu de praktijk en de woning van Kinesitherapeut en Osteopaat Arne Verstrynge en Marianne De Brée.
Dan volgde het lage huis van Ibeke (Urbanie) Moelaert en Camiel Matthys (1879), daar kwam later de lingeriewinkel van Paula Wabbes (1919) in nummer 78. Later is er de lingeriewinkel van Greet Verstrynge gekomen. Het grote huis ernaast, met twee ramen en een uitstalraam was de woning en de kruideniersgroothandel en winkel van Louis Bekaert en Cecilia Vanhyfte en familie. Alice Bekaert (1886) was winkelierster in de Noordstraat 80. In nummer 82 woonden de zoon van slager Leonard Dobbelaere (1882) en Irena Cauwels, vleeswarenfabrikant Albert Dobbelaere (1910) en Magd. Van de Genachte (1911). Dat wat de prentkaart betreft, Etc.
Belongs to picture Noordstraat.Image is from 1909!
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This is the sentence that is of importance , because it names , Camiel Matthys and the location of his house.
Dan volgde het lage huis van Ibeke (Urbanie) Moelaert en Camiel Matthys (1879), daar kwam later de lingeriewinkel van Paula Wabbes (1919) in nummer 78. Later is er de lingeriewinkel van Greet Verstrynge gekomen.
TRANSLAted---
Then followed the low house of Ibeke(Urbanie) Moelaert and Camiel matthys (1879) , later substituded by the lingeryshop of Paula Wabbes.(1919)in number 78.Later on the lingeryshop was owned by Greet Verstringe.
Some comment.(mine)
In the rest of the txt belonging to the picture, Posman states that the location of Ibeke's house is the one with the ladder(stairs) in front of it, and the painter working on it,on the sidewalk in front of it.
This is correct. That is house number 76 however , because 78 and 76 were clearly merged later on, to make way for a split.
In the two links below , it is easy to see the merge, the house that should have nr 78 has no front door, so merged with 76--and the number jumps to the former lingeryshop.
These two oldest houses , on the direct right side of the picture are clearly the same as well in the picture 1919, as in google maps, as in Inventaris onroerend erfgoed.The upholstery of the window
in wood , on the first hous to the right, is still present.(overpainted).
https://goo.gl/maps/VAz2VTXsJgo
https://inventaris.onroerenderfgoed.be/erfgoedobjecten/81794
Moelaert should be either his mother or his landlord.?
If you want to view the links properly and compare to text, i suggest you open several tabs at the same time, bit minimised.Works fine.
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My Grandfather Camiel would have been 7 years old @ this time. Did You receive the picture of the farmhome and the barn in the front on the rt side that I tried to email You. I also sent my Grandparents obituary cards. My Grandfather's birth certificate
. My parents when Dad returned to Zomergem in 1968 after being away for 40 years. Something about Charles Louis Matthys--who would be my Great-Grandfather, Joannes Baptiste Van Hulle. The Matthys siblings @ the 1968 Family Reunion.
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The certificate of birth/Leon states that Camiel is 31 years old at the birth of Leon, in 1904, so Camiel is from 1879, altough the Posman site claims 1872 as birthyear. It is possible that Posman took one of the other siblings date, ot is badly informed.
As the postcard is issued from 1904(checked), Camiel was 25 when the postcard was issued.
I found no pictures,but if you have pictures to show , i would suggest to mail them directly at
parser666@gmail.com
That should work.
I'll post something this evening,short of time now.
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Mistakes are easily made, saw that when a family book was written. People get tired. I will send You some pictures.
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Google was offline in Europe many times today, and i have different computers to run , and to maintain.The one i use most frequently for genealogy is not windows based , but linux,and i'm running different stretches of it,all simultanously.I have firewalls, and use Chromium on the 'Cinnamon-distro' , combined with an add blocker.But i moved you to the allowed list.
Tired , yes,i fully understand,many things came your way, on this forum.
Not only data but memory's are passing by, in the proces.Nobody is immune to that.
I did not answer the mails about your paintwork,Somerset,Mesa and some more because
i'm not interested, but because i was working on the case at hand, wich was to locate the file's containg your fathers entry into Canada.I also do some other work for history-related site's and geographic related issue's.But my real dada is WW1& 2.
I have no problem to talk about your paintings or your father's because my father was an artist , too.We had our own Bob Ross in the house.The whole family could live of my fathers paintings, and there was enough on top of it , to pay for hunting/rifles/clayshooting...name it.
In May, btw , a exhibition is arranged and payed for by the municipality and Province,
to display about 150 works of art my father made in the 70'ties around our hometown Assenede. Mostly he painted the creeks.Assenede has plenty.I have seen the catalogue in advance,it shows some of his best work. I like to share you the footage around end May.One of the works is made in Zomergem,i'll show you.
In Westdorpe,that was spoken of with Diane, the past weeks, lived the Painter that
was my Father teacher.His name was Leonce De Buck, and thanks to this forum i found his house back.On the same Graafjansdijk were i found my mother's father his house, on number 60 on the dyke.Leonce De Buck was a halfbrother of my mothers father.
This is all more related than one should expect.
But let us go back to our case at hand.
I hope you do not take it lightly, i made a real depth search.Study the page well, let it sedate some days and do not forget to breathe.
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Ready??
Library and archives Canada.
Passengers lists Saint John (1925 & 1935) including SS Melita.
Pay att to the line,consult help page to find a search strategy.
Pay att to the contact us line.
(it's all microfilm)
This is the page.(copy/paste the whole link)
There are 15 batches on the form.These are the containers with the manifests.It is an 'enormous' file.=>OCR won't work/smeared ink not indexed.
Conclusion,each and every line is to read depending on date-,name of passenger, and country of origin.Some field are missing.
Melita ,Minnedosa,an Montrose are present.This is most probably
the archive giving the match on Omer Matthys.(timestamp)
1) t-14845 =71 pages
2) t-14846 =601 pages
3) t-14847 =598 pages
4) t-14848 =593 pages
5) t-14849 =603 pages
6) t-14850 =620 pages
7) t-14851 =605 pages
8) t-14852 =599 pages
9) t-14853 =612 pages
10) t-14854 =592 pages
11) t-14855 =624 pages
12) t-14856 =627 pages
13) t-14857 =611 pages
14) t-14858 =615 pages
15) t-14859 =616 pages
Conclusive, expert level,or to read every line.Roughly personally i would exclude all years before 1925 and after 1931, to browse.
Or to make a decent bracke;;Taking incremental steps wih the pager like say, 10 pages at a time, this will reduce the load of 600 pages to 60
The years 1925 to 1927 are mainly in 14846 14847,14848,14849 , but possibly more. Margerat will find everything under the 't'numbers to click
I took a snip from t-14846 page 401 (use pager..)UP/down.
=Melita with many Belgians on the list; but date is 1925.
Another snip from t-14848 page 200 = Melita from Cherbourg(possible)
This is the example snip,about page 401 /melita/ Belgians on board.
My advice.
Start searching in t-14846,47,48,49,as i can see, 1925,1926,1927, i also see gaps around Januari(icebergs)?..Ships departed from Antwerp.(checked)
But i found the melita many times.
Ps , under the browse by title they have several 1000 pages more of fun.
Please Margaret either store this page or print it, i do not keep everything i find.(but i will keep it temporary)
If you should not understand something just ask.
Grtz , Adrie
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Thanks, I am so thankful for all the WORK You are putting in this project to keep my family alive. a death certificate is an important peace of paper, but we need memories and facts also. I do not have the knowledge to do this alone, but I will do my best with your advice.
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I do a lot of cycling, Margaret.When the weather improves,Zomergem will be on my path, and is well within my range too. This summer i will make first hand pictures for you only, of all the farms,and the specific farm of your target.All hand picked.After the weekend i will help you to start making an inventory of the entry's about the shipsmanifests.
Coming back at the postcard from 1904 on Posman's site, and the fact that Camiel lived there, it is possible i suppose, that Leon is born in that house?He is born in 1904 right?
Do you like me to search for the postcard, maybe it can be found on the web for a few bucks?
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Dad was born March 18, 1904 and I think he was born in the home in town on Ro. Omer Verhelst might know where it is. I think Dad said they lived there first and then moved to the farm site. Simonne Van Neste (Julien Claeys's wife) might also know. She is now living with her daughter Katrien Claeys. Her Aunt Nellie still lives in Zomergem.
My Dad also cycled and raced in the vieoldrum.
Yes, I would like You to search for the postcard, and let me know how much I owe You. Thanks
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Okay, i will try to search for it,its not mandatory of course.The best way of understanding 'Ro' is to regard it as a neighbourhood,only consisting of some houses , some farms and a chapel.'Beke', was also such a part of Somerghem.The word or term is only used locally.
In my home town in Assenede we have or had a number of these places.but only local people still use them sometimes
.Where i lived was Called the 'Staak', another place in Assenede is Muikem.All of these dissolved , and are used only local.
If you like to know were Ro is , basically,just search Zomergem at the prompt in Google
earth, and it is nearly the complete lower part of Zomergem.In fact there was a moat there dividing the farmland and the inclination of this moat , that is about 2meter of depth in the terrain is called Rho or Ro,.. The exact start of the area is to the left of 'Rostraat', and then the whole Rostraat area.The chapel in the Rostraat is still there.
Your father will have passed it many times.
Adrie
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Dad only lived there as a baby, He spent most of his life on the farm near Oostende on Longstraat
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The weatherforecast promised me a terrible storm today, so probably i will have time to do some query.
I think i found Omer Verhelst , and were he lives, its only 3 streets away from Ro. I will keep his adress stored , will come in handy later on.
Hm, Oostende, probably you mean to say Oostwinkel; these names are confusing i have to admit.
I have no idea how old Omer is , could you roughly indicate his age?..
Adrie
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I will give You Omer Verhelst 's phone # in an email. I remember when he had is 80th birthday. He is one of these people that never ages. Age does not matter to me, so I will look up in my facebook and see when he had his last birthday. Dad & Omer met in 1968 when Omer owned a tavern......many laughs & friendship. I believe Omer was Mayor of Zomergam for sometime.
I get my Flemish towns mixed up because the little town of Swan Lake where I was born was mostly Flemish. Heard lots since many people did not realize that I understood Flemish as a young kid.
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Omer is 93. I sent You his phone #.
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I understand what you say, my wife is Turkish,but was raised here,and masters the Flemish dialects,as well as Dutch,and her own language.When we are in Turkey, people
there hear her speak Flemish, so respond in Flemish because many Turkish people have
roots here in Ghent.But when my wife switches to Turkish ; their mouth falls open,as they did not expect it.
i'm browsing in the files of target, and they look promising until now,i'm searching for patterns,stowaway's, vessels that arouse my suspicion.Th Ss Marloch is one of them.
I checked one list of 71 pages, the first batch,to determine the way of approaching.
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It is always an advantage to know more languages.
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Thanks to the Zomergem catalogue entry that was kindly provided by M Juengling,i was able to find
Camiel's father , Margaret.He was born in Adegem, in 1848- Charles Louis matthijs
Here is the civil record entry
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939V-Z3S7-6Q?i=366&cc=2138513&cat=333350
No need for attention to the Mathijs name above it, only one 't'
Its a very nasty one to try to print, so i would rather suggest to copy paste it to a file, or to type it over, all the children,you won't find the father or the mother on that spreadsheet,its a so called 10 years table.
But i will locate them later on.
There are 2 specials in the batch of children, can you find them?....
I have another independent source about Charles Louis,and his brothers, someone will send it to me the coming week.
Adrie
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Charles Louis Matthys 2 Jan 1848
Leonard Matthys 24th 1850 whom I am guessing is whom my Father is named after. They loved to name children after an elder.
I also saw a Eugenia Van Hulle 19 Jul9 1844
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i'v sorted out the batch of Léonie and the children of Carel Francies Matthijs and Marie Therese Van De Velde.Please store the url's and pagenumbers and copy the whole bundle.
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https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GG8S-ZP7?i=140&cc=2138513&cat=13877
Geb 1851 te Ursel,zonder de (ae) , ! certificaat heeft een spelling aangehouden die niet de originele is. (Juiste spelling ,DE JAGER)!
Ursel , births, film 004774440
image 141 from 417.
So her birthname in full is Léonie Sophie De Jager. (correct spelling)
mother =Seraphina De Baets.
Father =Augustus De Jager.
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In the year 1851 at 7 Oktober around 11 in the morning; before us- Ferdinand Lampaert , Mayor,
Servant of the civil record in the municipality of Ursel,Arrondisement Gent,Province East -Flanders, appeared,Augustus De Jager,farmer born and living in Ursel , wijk Dries;and who showed us a child of the female gender,born in the house of his parents,7 before 6 hour in the morning, from him the declarant and his housewife Seraphina De Baets, 25 years old, born in Ursel,and living with him, has given the chosen name Leonie Sophie. The deed above is publicly done in the presence of,Jaques Roelands age 52 years ('veldwachter')(sort of mountie)
living in Ursel , and Pieter Jacobus Gilles age,58 Cafékeeper also living in Ursel.
Then some formality's and signatures, mayor and witnesses, August De jager.
De Jager , not De Jaeger as later on , written in Zomergem.
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Next is birthcertificate Petrus Bernardus Matthijs.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939V-Z3SC-38?i=418&cc=2138513&cat=333350
page 419 from 575
Belgium , East-Flanders,c;;;l registration 1541 1914 Adegem,births 1833_50
At the same event , it becomes clear, who the father is of Carel Francies Matthijs who is himself married with Marie Theresia Van De Velde.
His father is,'Pieter Matthijs'& and Marie Theresia Vymene( wife)
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In the year 1844 On 22 of August at 8hrs in the evening; before us,Jan Deweert , Mayor
civil servant of the civil record in Adegem, Arrondisement , Eeklo,Province , East -Flanders,
did appear,Carel Francies Matthijs, farmer age 41 years,Living in this municipality (church-wijk)(Adegem) and born here;Son of Pieter and Marie Theresia Vymene and he showed us,a child of
manly gender,and born here on (gisteren-yesterday ) (eight?) hours afternoon,out of him and
Marie Therese Van De Velde his housewife aged 32 years born at Someghem, daughter of
Jacobus and Marie Anne Van Rijssel,and whom the choisen name is given of Petrus Bernardus.
Declaration is done in the presence of Amilouvingt(?) Van Haecke , working man,aged 39 years,
and Carel Deflou, working man,aged 42 years,both here present and neighbours of the child as
witnesses,after the deed is read out aloud, do not co sign , and declare to be analphabetes,
after wich Carel Francies Mattijs signs the deed together wit the mayor,Jan Deweert .
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Next in Line and kin , birthcertificate of Augustus Josephus Matthijs.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939V-Z3SC-33?i=475&cc=2138513&cat=333350
Page 476 from 575
Mind the difference, 1847 Not 1846 like in the 10 year table.
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In the year 1847 at 21st of May, at late in the afternoon,Before us, Jan Deweert, Mayor,
civil servant from the municipality Adegem,Arrondisement Eeclo,say as Eeclo,Province East-Flanders, has come before us,Carel Francies Matthijs,Farmer,aged 45 years,living in this
municipality,( te Kerkdijk) (dyke of the church) clarification mine,and also born here, son
of Pieter and Marie Therese Vymene, and has showed us, a child of the manly gender born here
yesterday at ten in the evening, from him and Marie Theresia Van De Velde ,his houswife,
aged 34 , born in Somergem,dauchter of Jacobus and Marie Anne Van Rijssel, and whom the chosen name is given of Augustus Josephus.Declaration is done in the presence of Van Eename Werner aged 43 living here and born here,Neighbours and witness,after reading aloud and done
of deed, do sign their companions for them ,because they declared to be analphabetes.
Carel Matthijs signs the deed with the mayor, J Deweert.
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next of kin.
Charles Louis Matthijs,
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939V-Z3S4-VR?i=512&cc=2138513&cat=333350
Page 513 of 575
In the year 1848 on 2th June at 12' noons ;before us, Pieter Francies Willems( schepen) appointed civil servant,acting on behalf of the mayor,municipality Adegem,Arrondisement , Eeklo , East Flanders,did appear, Carel Francies Matthijs,farmer,age 45 years ,born here,
son of Pieter and Marie Therese Vymene, born here , and showed us a child of manly gender,
born here,yesterday at 10hour,5 (and halfhour?)(?), in the afternoon,from him and his housewife,maria Therese Van De Velde, age 36 years, born in Somergem,Daughter from Jacobus
and Marie Anne Van Rijssel,declaring to have chosen the name of Charles Louis . Deed done in the presence of Felix Van De Velde,bakeryhelper,age 27 years, and Jan Francies De Bruyckere, working man,aged 55 years,living here , and being a neighbour of the child.
After reading aloud in the presence of the comparants,signs the 'Schepen'(counsil-member)by
exeption,so noted,and JF de Bruyckere, witness.
Then Carel matthijs and Pf Willems.
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next of kin.
Leonardus matthijs
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939V-Z3SW-6G?i=569&cc=2138513&cat=333350
page 570 from 575
In the year 1850 at the 28 st December round 11 before noon,before us,Jan Deweert, Mayor,
civil record servant, Mayorof the municipality Adegem,Arrondisement Gent-Eeklo, Province East-Flanders, appeared before us, Carel Francies Matthijs, farmer aged 47 , born and living in Adegem,Churchwijk,Son of Pieter and from Marie Therese Vymene,and showed us, a child of manly gender,born here on yesterday at halffive in the afternoon,from him and his housewife Marie Therese Van De Velde, aged 39,born in Somergem, daughter of Jacobus Francies and Marie-Anne Van Rijssel,and they declare to have chosen the name of,Leonardus,Deed is done in the presence of Francies SernuL(?)millkeeper aged 48 years , and Jan Francies De Bruyckere,
working man,aged,57 , living here,no relative of the child as a witness.
After reading aloud, in the presence of comparants,Father witness and civil servant,the deed is signed by Camiel matthijs and the Mayor after the other comparants declared to be analphabetes.
(No 'relative' is debatable,the word, -badly chosen is 'geen gemeenschap' as to say they are
unrelated.)it basically means nothing commonly.
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