Johannes Rose finding his birthplace in Germany

widholmfamily

LD1M-2P3 Johannes Rose came to America in 1858 on the ship Athena with his wife LD1M-2RY Juliana Ritzel and infant son Reinhard Rose LD1M-LS6. I am trying to locate their birthplace in Germany. I believe the ship sailed from Bremen but most records just list their birthplace as Germany and some as Hessen. Can anyone help discover where in Germany this family came from? Thanks in advance

sylviaelchinger1

Have you tried looking for naturalization records? Here's a link to naturalization records for New York, perhaps you can find him there.

https://www.familysearch.org/search/catalog/674806?availability=Family%20History%20Library

I'm not sure what's available for that time period in NY, but generally, you should look for a declaration of intention and a petition for naturalization - these two documents will have the most information about the person and where he was from.

Another suggestion is to look at the German-language newspapers in NY for the time that he lived there. Ethnic newspapers often contain more/other details than the English-language papers, because they're talking to their own community. Here's a link to German-language newspapers published in NYC, but I don't know how many of them are digitized -

https://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/search/titles/results/?state=New+York&county=&city=New+York&year1=1690&year2=2023&terms=&frequency=&language=German&ethnicity=&labor=&material_type=&lccn=&rows=20

There was a German Immigrant Society in NY that helped people get settled when they came over. Perhaps you can find something there.

JohnsonGreg

In the 1865 New York census he is living in Ward 16, Brooklyn, Kings, New York, with a sister Katy Rose who was born 1849. There is a Katherine Rose (see G9KV-TZ3) who was also born 1849 who marries in 1867 in Brooklyn, Kings, New York. This might be his sister Katy.

In this marriage record she lists her place of birth as Hirsfeld, Kurhessen. Kurhessen is another name for Hesse-Kassel or Electoral Hesse. The closest town I can find to "Hirsfeld" is a town named Hersfeld.

So it might be worthwhile to investigate Hersfeld as a potential place of birth:

https://www.meyersgaz.org/place/10782011

Can you also try to get an actual copy of the marriage record (or find a church record of the marriage) of Johannes Rose in New York 29 Aug 1858? The indexed copy doesn't give a detailed place of birth or parents names but the actual record or a church record might.

JohnsonGreg

The Katherine Rose was indeed from Hersfeld per her 1864 immigration record:

https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/5232345:1068?tid=10089788&pid=262358478031&queryId=0d2656c44b72010d36ee2fa8dab3c281&_phsrc=xWz2990&_phstart=successSource

She seems to be traveling with three other people from Hersfeld with different surnames.

Archion might have the baptismal records for according to:

https://www.familysearch.org/en/wiki/Hersfeld_Parishes,_Hesse-Nassau,_Prussia,_German_Empire_Genealogy

BaerbelJ

I have access to Archion and checked the baptisms of the Hersfeld city church for around 1836. There were no Rose entries, but I think Juliana Ritzel was there, born on 17 Nov 1836 to Adam Ritzel and Wilhelmine Weichel. The link is https://www.archion.de/p/91a6f3b159/ , but you can only see the entry if you have a subscription.

I also checked the marriages for that same church but did not find the couple listed in the index. Bad Hersfeld has several other churches, though, and it is also a county seat, so it's probably just a matter of checking the surrounding parishes. Also, the surname Rose is often spelled Roos in Germany.

Good luck!

Baerbel