Help with Rev David Ab Rees
@AaronArthurDavis has requested this help. Please refer to him and not me. @Cedar Kedar can you take a look at this?
I will need help with locating these records in Wales.
1. Probate or will records of a Rev. David Ab Rees about 1680's
2. The Marriage Records of John Davies in these parishes in Mount, Tre-Main, Blaen Porth, and Aberporth before 1800's.
3. The Guide or the parish chest records for the same parishes in the same time frame if they exist.
4. My road block is that my web search indicates that these records may be in the local arcives ( Cardigan Arcives or National library of Wales) on micro fish and have not been digitalized. They will also probably be in Welsh.
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@Cedar Kedar I have located the Blaenaerch Welsh Calvinistic Methodist Church built in 1794 for the cause of 1740. Have also located John Davies as the son so the brother of Anne Davies in her will out of Mount. In the Freered John Davies is born in 1775 and his father is John Davies. In ancestry there is a David Davies connected to a John David no a military record with a birth in aberporth in 1806. I believe that they are two different families and mine is more in the non conformist records. The non conformist church is just outside of aberporth. How would I know if records exist.
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@AaronArthurDavis I found some information on where you can find these records at the following site
https://www.familysearch.org/en/wiki/Cardiganshire_Nonconformist_Records
The following discussion was on the FamilySearch Community home page that may also give you some additional information as you find these records.
I hope these websites help you in your research.
Kind Regards,
Shannon
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- Probate or Wills for 1680s https://www.library.wales/catalogues-searching/catalogues/specialist-catalogues/wills. https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1876640?collectionNameFilter=false https://search.findmypast.com/search-world-records/wales-probate-records-1544-1858 (this a paid per site if you are not a member) https://www.familysearch.org/en/wiki/Wales_Probate_Records https://www.ancestry.com/search/collections/61635/ https://www.library.wales/catalogues-searching/catalogues/specialist-catalogues/wills
- https://www.familysearch.org/en/wiki/Wales_Civil_Registration
- Locating Parish Chest Records
The variation in what parish chest records have survived from parish to parish is staggering. Some parishes may have an almost complete set of record types, while others might have virtually nothing still extant—and every combination in between. When searching for parish chest records, keep an open mind and search multiple repositories. What is filmed vs. what is at the county records office will vary again from what might still be at the local parish church.In addition to the difficulties in locating the physical records, locating pertinent entries within the records can be difficult. Many of the records are spotty and unindexed, requiring a patient researcher with a strong knowledge of early English handwriting and practices. Check with the applicable county records office for available indexes, even if utilizing Family History Library microfilm.
FamilySearch/Family History Library
FamilySearch initially focused only on microfilming parish registers at the diocesan level—known as the Bishop's Transcripts. Later on, however, they returned to the county record offices and filmed the original parishes and some parish chest records. The number of parish chest records filmed for a particular parish will depend on the licensing agreements between the county and the LDS Church as well as what records were readily available at the time of filming. In the Family History Library Catalog, these records may be listed as "parish chest" records, or any of the types of records listed above. Just because something is cataloged as "vestry minutes" does not mean that is all the film includes.
County Record Offices
The most complete collection of parish chest records for a given county will be in the local county record office. While not all have been filmed by the LDS Church, virtually all have been placed at the local county record office.
4.The good news is if in Welsh, google translate can help you to be able to get the translation. If in the local county, you may have to write to them to get a copy of the records.
I know this is a lot of information, but it can send you in the direction you need to go to find some of these records.
Kind Regards,
Shannon
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@Shannon Potter Wilcox Thanks. If you do not mind I am just going to write some brief notes here on this forum.I did go to the forum, find my past and wales probate link in family search. I went through over 1000 John Davies for the smithing record in the census, It looks like it will be about the same with the wills. For me it is dividing the two congregations in Aberporth. My assumption is that my family where Methodist. I putting my faith that the 1851 census is correct with the birth place of John Davies son David Davies in about 1799-1802. I reached out to a researcher on ancestry that traces their linage to a David Davies in Aberporth in 1806. The records are from the Anglican Church. John Davies would have to marry in the Anglican Church at the time. Aberporth I figure had about 500 people at the time. My goal is to reconstruct a census of the area using the two churches and the wills. I haven't gotten into the tithe records yet.
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@Darris Williams considering you have experience in non conformist records but according to your post it is closer to eastern Wales. I have located the Anglican Church records but it seems that the John Davies did not exist until 1805. The Davies existed started in the marriage records in 1763. And a last name of David also is throughout the record. I found a marriage bond of John Davies with Mariot Owens in Verwick in 1798,but their was no Anglican or non conformist church in the area according to Genuki. The Anglican Church in Aberporth covers this area and the Calvinist Methodist cause covers the area as well but the record gap from the cause to the church being built is from 1740-1800's. What are my options?
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@AaronArthurDavis For the time period you are searching you should consider Davies and David as the same name. That was a transition period from patronymics to fixed surnames so always look at both variants before 1800.
The book, Nonconformist Registers of Wales is the authority for nonconformist records deposited with a record office as of the publication year of 1994.
The link that @Shannon Potter Wilcox provided previously is the next step for finding nonconformist records. https://www.familysearch.org/en/wiki/Cardiganshire_Nonconformist_Records It should include the information found in Nonconformist Registers of Wales and additional information. This wiki page is a work in progress and may not lead to some of the additional sources you need for Aberporth. The monumental inscriptions for the chapel may be available and will often supplement the late start of chapel registers containing christening and burial records. Another source you should obtain is any chapel history or local history. Histories and biographies of the ministers at a chapel can be extremely useful. The book, Welsh Rural Communities edited by Elwyn Davies and Alwyn D. Rees has the first chapter on Aberporth by David Jenkins. This chapter has 63 pages and should be a high priority on your reading list.
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Thanks @Darris Williams .
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@Darris Williams these are my fathers notes
John Davies (1839-1918), David and Mary Davies’ youngest son, indicates that the whole family joined the LDS Church in about 1850. But I was unable to identify the David and Mary Davies’ family in the LDS Branch¬es of Tredegar (film #104172), Ebby Vale, Rhymney (film #104171), Pontypool (film #104171) or Merthyr Tydfil (film #104170).
John also indicated that he and his father left Wales and emigrated to America in 1853. (In the 1900 & 1910 census John indicated that he emigrated in 1859) John states in a letter in 1917 that he had one brother, David and four sisters, Esther, Jane, Mary and Ann who stayed in Wales when he and his father came to America. (A family tradition passed on to me , 2001)
There is an article in the Liahona for April 2023 by Jill Morgan about the Lyfr Mormon and the translation being done in Merthr Tydfil 170 years ago by a John Sylvanus Davis. This would make the translation about 1852. What are my chances in getting a hold of Jill Morgan?
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@Israelshallprevail you can go into this site to see if you can find your family that joined The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. http://www.welshsaints.byu.edu/ I don't know how to get a hold of Jill Morgan, but I read her article. Here is Mary Deer on FamilySearch Mary Deer KWJY-ZPF There is a biography on her as well as her children with David Davis.
I would also like to direct you to the Wales Research Resource Links at the top of the home page for Wales. You may find some additional information that may help you. Research Resource Links If I can help further, please let me know.
Kind regards,
Shannon
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@Shannon Potter Wilcox @Darris Williams @PABulfinch After looking at the indexes of the two aberporth records at the family search library I came up with two John Davies in the record with births around 1770 but in a parish considerably south of aberporth. My research into the Anglican Church in Mynt called the holy cross would have covered all of this country side of south Western Cardiganshire. According to my Google search both the Anglican and Calvinist where allowed to preach in this church. The book that was recommended on aberporth has no data before the 1800's. The sample size on familytreeDNA is only 2 million test takers. The matches I have reached are also stuck about the Late 1700' to the early 1800's and my YDNA has no variations past the 1050 AD in Wales. This is before William the conquerer in 1066. The other variant person is back to 950 in Scotland. The reference to the other aberporth methodist record is NLW4.I am not familiar with this notation for the nation library of Wales. I have checked the Mary Deer persons page and have come to the conclusion that it is not close to my ancestry. David Davies and possibly his father did migration from the west coast of wales to the East boarder of Wales about 1820. The migration pattern was practice also in 1850's with the same family in to Deseret.If by possibility this family would have been migrant works their are only two classes within Europe. They would have been Free masons or Free smiths having no country. They would have to have papers from the guilds to practice their trades. I have been down to the BYU family history library and the missionary was stating I need to do fishing on Find my past, my Heritage ,Ancestry and Family search. I asked the AG person in Salt Lake if they had any experience using office 365 auto pilot, open AI GPT 3 or GPT 4 or Google Brad to create effective research tools for genealogy. Only four people in salt lake have looked at these systems but do not know how to apply it to genealogy research. When visual tools will be connected to indexing, my concern is that the system will be overwhelmed with data. I had a pretty good idea that the records may not have existed for this line when I started but I knew that if I went down this rabbit whole I would be able to look at creating new tools for genealogy research. The tool is not for my gain but for the gathering of the lost 10 tribes for that is the most important work we could be doing according to president Russel M. Nelson. The stats for wales ancestry in the church works well with Perato's law of 20/80 rule according to the Welsh research at BYU. I am working on the slope and the 1% rule in James Clear's book " Atomic Habits"that was referenced in general conference on the British cycling team for my genealogy research. The Lord is in the details. I am just trying to land my plain on the right run way. I am just trying to align my will with the prophet and my God. Thanks for the help.
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@PABulfinch @Darrin E. Helm@Darris Williams @Shannon Potter Wilcox
Thought I give you a copy of this it took 3 seconds after the giving a prompt into chat GTP AI:
Promt:
How can I use geneology research from 1840's to current, Y-DNA, Mt-DNA and Autosomal DNA to connect the common pytranimic names of Wales and Irland?
AI Answer:
Connecting the common patronymic names of Wales and Ireland through genealogy research can be a complex task, but DNA testing can provide useful insights into potential ancestral connections. Here are some steps you can take to explore this further:
1.Start with traditional genealogical research: Begin by researching your family history and constructing a family tree as far back as possible. Gather as much information as you can about your ancestors' names, birth and death dates, locations, occupations, and other relevant details. Use public records such as birth, marriage, and death certificates, census records, and church registers to build a solid foundation for your research.
2.Consider taking a DNA test: DNA testing can help you identify potential genetic connections to other individuals who share your surname or who have traced their ancestry to the same geographic region. There are several types of DNA tests available, including Y-DNA, mtDNA, and autosomal DNA tests.
3.Y-DNA testing: Y-DNA testing analyzes the DNA on the Y chromosome, which is passed down from father to son. This test can help you trace your paternal line back several generations and identify potential genetic matches with other individuals who share your surname. This test can also help you determine the haplogroup of your paternal line, which can give you insights into your ancient ancestry.
4.MtDNA testing: MtDNA testing analyzes the DNA in the mitochondria, which is passed down from mother to both sons and daughters. This test can help you trace your maternal line back several generations and identify potential genetic matches with other individuals who share your mtDNA. This test can also help you determine the haplogroup of your maternal line, which can give you insights into your ancient ancestry.
5.Autosomal DNA testing: Autosomal DNA testing analyzes the DNA on the 22 pairs of chromosomes that are not sex chromosomes. This test can help you identify genetic matches with both maternal and paternal lines, as well as with more distant relatives. Autosomal DNA testing can also help you estimate your ethnicity and identify potential genetic matches with individuals who share a common geographic ancestry.
6.Use DNA test results to connect the dots: Once you have received your DNA test results, you can use them to identify potential genetic matches with other individuals who have taken the same test. Look for individuals who share your surname or who have traced their ancestry to the same geographic region. You can also use online genealogy databases, such as Ancestry.com or FamilySearch.org, to explore potential ancestral connections based on shared DNA.
7.Explore other sources: In addition to DNA testing, you can also explore other sources of information, such as historical records, family histories, and local histories. Look for information about migration patterns, naming patterns, and other cultural factors that may shed light on potential ancestral connections.
Overall, connecting the common patronymic names of Wales and Ireland through genealogy research and DNA testing requires patience, persistence, and attention to detail. By combining traditional research methods with the latest advances in DNA testing, you can uncover new insights into your family history and potentially connect with distant relatives who share your ancestral roots.
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@Israelshallprevail Fascinating! Thank you for sharing 🎉
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This book might help you. Chapter III p. 19
Genealogy of the Reese family in Wales and America, from their arrival in America to the present time
by
Reese, Mary E. (Mary Eleanora)
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