Translation Assistance

RichardMurison

I would appreciate some help with an old Austrian document. It is a birth record from the parish of St Johann am Brückl, Kärnten, Austria, dating from 1698. The entry is in Latin. I have a pretty good idea of what the document is trying to say, but there are some Latin phrases in there that puzzle me. If anybody could lay this out for me I would be most grateful.

RichardMurison

Thanks @Robert Seal_1

This is helpful. It confirms what I had hoped to hear. I did wonder about the "Latinization" of the names. I see a lot of that in those records.

I'm inclined to think that because Agnes and Agnete are both present in the same record, then this must indicate two distinct variations of the name in use. It's not the only instance of an Agnes and an Agnete both appearing in the same record. I guess some things we will never know ....

Can you clarify for me the phrase "et giugus eig"? None of my on-line Latin resources are able to make anything of it. It obviously conveys "and his wife", but I would like to understand what that odd verbiage is all about. You see it a lot in that particular book

I did not make the connection that Rosman was the baptising priest. So that's good!

Robert Seal_1

Hello @RichardMurison,

Here is a translated abstract of this record:

Baptismal date: 22 April [1698].

Child: Agnes, legitimate daughter

Parents: Carl Jandl and his wife Agnes [no maiden surname for the wife].

Baptizing priest: "Primum"? Rosman, cooperator [i.e., assistant priest, curate, chaplain].

Godmother: Agnes Lobniggin.

My comments: I am treating the names "Agnetis" and "Agnete" as Latin declensions of the name "Agnes".

If "Primum" is the first name of the baptizing priest, then this form could be a Latin declension of the male name "Primus".

I don't recognize the symbol at the beginning of the 3rd line nor the word which comes after that symbol.

Hope this helps you out.

Robert Seal_1

Hello @RichardMurison,

Re: et giugus eig

Note that I put in bold two symbols that look like the letter" g" but are actually Latin scribal symbols.

giugus: In this word the symbol represents the letters: con. This makes the word: coniugus.

eig: In this word the symbol represents the letters: us. This makes the word: eius.

Thus the phrase "et coniugus eius" translates as: and his wife.

Here is a link to a booklet on Latin abbreviations and scribal symbols: https://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/213385262.pdf

Go to section 3 in this booklet for these Latin scribal symbols as well as others.

Julia Szent-Györgyi

No, the appearance of both Agnes and Agnete does not indicate two distinct variations in use. It's just Latin grammar.

Agnes is a third declension noun. Agnes is the nominative case, i.e. the form used when it's the subject. Agnetis is the genitive case, which is broadly speaking the possessive form. Agnete is the ablative case, which is used with various prepositions, and usually indicates "from", "with", or "in/at".

In general, when names are written in Latin, the given names are translated into Latin, and all of the rules of Latin grammar are applied to them, while the surnames are left in their vernacular form and added after the given names, without any changes for grammar. Thus for example in your screenshot, you can see "Agnes Caroli Jandl et coniugis eius Agnetis fil. legt.", which is basically "Agnes, Carl's Jandl and wife of his Agnes's dau. legit.", that is, "Agnes, the legitimate daughter of Carl Jandl and of his wife Agnes".

(Carl in Latin is Carolus, and like most masculine names, it is a second declension noun, meaning it's Carolus for nominative and Caroli for genitive. Those are the two cases encountered most often in names.)

Robert Seal_1

Thanks, Julia, for an excellent Latin lesson.