Familybook II page 340 Friederike film 102118620 page 1248

Kent Gardiner

Translation request:

A few questions regarding Philipp Martin Werner and Friederike Krauss' family:

Kinder:

1. Friederike illegitimate?
2. Philipp Martin
3. Catharina Christina, emigrated to America
4. Karolina
5. ? no idea
6. Luisa. Is the reason for death included?
7. Carol
8. Heinrich
9. Hermann
10. Albert

What happened in 1880 at the bottom of the page? emigrated? Is this why Philipp and Friederike's death dates are not entered?

Robert Seal_1

@Kent Gardiner

Good Sunday morning to you, Kent,

Answers to your questions:

Kinder:

1. (before the marriage) Friederike (recognized [by the father])
2. Philipp Martin
3. Catharina Christina, emigrated to America
4. Karolina
5. Todtgeborens Knäblein [= stillborn little boy]
6. Luisa died before baptism
7. Carl
8. Heinrich
9. Hermann
10. Albert

What happened in 1880 at the bottom of the page? emigrated? Is this why Philipp and Friederike's death dates are not entered?

Yes, the family emigrated ("Ausgewandert") in 1880, which explains why there are no death dates for the parents. Given that "America" is written for at least child 3 (and one might argue that "America" is written in such a way that it applies to the entire family on this page), they probably emigrated to America in 1880.

Robert Seal_1

Hello KG,

It's possible the following link from Ancestry is for your Philipp Martin Werner's arrival in New York in March 1880: https://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc=FVk1542&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&indiv=1&dbid=7488&gsfn=philipp&gsln=werner&msady=1880&msady_x=1&new=1&rank=1&uidh=j6c&redir=false&msT=1&gss=angs-d&pcat=40&fh=2&h=11616434&recoff=&ml_rpos=3&queryId=46ded835f56984f44ffb10349c2721a8

Fourth line down; but note that his age is off by 10 years. Your Philipp Martin Werner was born in 1834.

Here's another link from Ancestry which may be useful: https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/3534377:7486?tid=&pid=&queryId=bc5144db17f2d000573fd4a80501f110&_phsrc=FVk1546&_phstart=successSource

Robert Seal_1

Hello KG,

Great photo! Thanks for sharing. I'm going to say that your son is on the left. Right or wrong?

Back to genealogy: I would argue that the following link from Ancestry is for the death of Friederike (Krauss) Werner on 3 May 1886 in Chicago, Cook County, Illinois: https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/1109536:9758 Obviously she didn't die in Texas.

This is likely to be Philipp Martin Werner's gravestone (1834-1903) in Cook County, Illinois, which he shares with his daughter Katharina and his son-in-law Dietrech: https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/55815584:60525?tid=&pid=&queryId=736f5ab0e94d93bacd67c9100a4902c5&_phsrc=FVk1555&_phstart=successSource

And this is likely Philipp's August 1903 death certificate from Cook County, Illinois: https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/792955:2552

Note that in this death certificate his age of 58 is about 10 years too young. Born in October 1834, Philipp would have been two months shy of turning 69 years old in October 1903.

Robert Seal_1

Hello Kent,

Here is the link from Ancestry for the arrival of Friederike (Krauss) Werner and her six children in New York in July 1880: https://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&dbid=7488&h=11031247&tid=&pid=&queryId=e6a99facc72bcd5d1249ceac00638725&usePUB=true&_phsrc=FVk1528&_phstart=successSource

Starting on the second line:

Friedrike Werner

Catherine Krauss (a relative of Friederike, likely a sister)

Philipp Wener

Friedrike Werner

Catharine Werner

Caroline Werner

Heinrich Werner

Albert Werner

Comment: It was not unusual for the husband/father to emigrate first, get settled, and then have the rest of the family follow.

Kent Gardiner

Robert Seal_1 Thanks Robert. I appreciate the extra help with the emigration records. Someone on Ancestry says Friedrike died in Texas but I haven't found anything to authenticate this assertion. It appears that usually when a child is born out of wedlock the parents marry soon there after.

My youngest brother is in town for a visit. My son and a friend went fishing for catfish yesterday on Utah Lake!. Caught 12 big ones and later in the evening had a fish fry. Very tasty if you know how to cook them. Great fun.

All the best, Kent

Kent Gardiner

Robert Seal_ Thanks for all the research!!! Great find on locating the death of Friederike!!! Yes my son is holding the Catfish! Bur of course you know that. Kent