Why don't I see the before and after text when someone changes a source reason.
There is a user, TreeBuilding Project, that keeps deleting the source reason for sources that I've created. I've messaged them twice asking what I might be doing wrong, and no response. I wondered if it might be an automated system "cleaning" bad entries.
The legacy change log only gives me the following:
Since the source reason is tied both to the source and to the profile, this change doesn't show up in the history of the source, only in the log of the profile. But it doesn't show the before or after text of the source reason. So it requires a lot more effort to restore it.
I wondered if the improved person change log would provide more detail. Alas, not more but less.
It doesn't even give me the hint the the update was in the source reason. So this is a step backward. A step forward would be to indicate that the Source Reason changed AND to provide the before and after text of the Source Reason.
Best Answer
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@ShawnFReid Thanks for the suggestion!
We'll take a look and see what we can do to get more information in the list of changes.
Thanks!1
Answers
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The username TreeBuilding Project relates to the very many automated inserts and updates done by the BYU Record Linking Lab. If you have a minute, see this long thread for more information:
Meanwhile please post the person ID (pid) for your example if possible, as I would like to look into this in more detail (this is not a record collection I have seen them engage with previously).
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Thanks @MandyShaw1 for your response and information. Apparently they are losing my Source Reason when doing their updates and that information is not represented in the change log. Having it preserved in the change log would help me fix what they are breaking.
Here are some PIDs.
These are two example from sources I've created for documents that don't exist in the FamilySearch ecosystem. They are from my decades of research with unpublished Italian parish records. So they are not part of of a record collection. These sources are where I see the vast majority of the TreeBuilding Project changes in profiles I care about. Many of these would have a Source Reason, typically something like "Mentioned in death record of grandchild".
Allegra Furlano - PQXN-861
Francesca Gorasso - GVTF-F2D
Here are a couple of example from FamilySearch published record collections. These typically would NOT have Source Reasons, but the change log says that the Source Reason was changed.
Benvenuta Zermanini - GZT3-FNX
Antonio Bragutto - G696-W2C1 -
@ShawnFReid Thank you for bringing this to our attention and for the PIDs. We have informed the team over Tree Building of the issue to have them check it out.
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Thank you @shecorwe !
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@shecorwe Please keep this thread posted on the progress of this report - to date we have had zero success trying to get BYU RLL to resolve any issue we have reported to them (see the thread I linked to above).
@ShawnFReid Thanks for the PIDs, I will look to add this issue to the evidence I am collecting re BYU RLL's impact on the data quality of the Tree.
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@MandyShaw1 and/or @shecorwe, do you know if there will be someone looking into the change log side of things to see if the details of the Source Reason change can go into the log? That was the original intent of the question. ☺️ (Stopping the breakage would be wonderful, but also being able to detect and fix the problems would be great). Thanks!
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@shecorwe will know as a mod, @ShawnFReid, I am an ordinary user not a FS person.
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Thanks @MandyShaw1. I'm sure you're nothing like an ordinary user. But I understand. 🙂
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@shecorwe did you ever get any feedback on this, please?
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@MandyShaw1 We do not have an update at this time, but the issue has been reported.
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After some investigation via my analysis database I think I have got to the bottom of this.
In my view the issue is that BYU RLL's automation scripting (user TreeBuilding Project) is using the Update Person Source Reference API in an inappropriate manner when adding source tags to sources attached by other people.
I found 57 attachments, including various of Shawn's as above (and coincidentally also one of my own) where an existing 'Reason This Source Is Attached' was cleared by TreeBuilding Project.
I am pretty confident the API itself is fine - I did a tag change via RootsMagic and my 'Reason This Source Is Attached' was, as expected, unaffected.
The really key point here is that, in the underlying data, the 'Reason This Source Is Attached' is not stored as a 'change info reason', as are seemingly all other reason statements, it is stored as an 'attribution changeMessage'. If you want it to remain in place after an Update Person Source Reference API call, it would appear that you need to retrieve the initial value first and resend it on the API call, otherwise it is cleared, as we are seeing. See . BYU RLL is (typically) clearly not looking at the existing data at all; not only do they lose the 'Reason This Source Is Attached' when they actually change the tags, they also make a pointless (but still potentially damaging) API call when the tags were already set how they wanted them (resulting in the Change Log entries we are seeing on which no actual change is indicated).
I will add this matter to the detailed BYU RLL data quality incident report I am about to submit - see my latest comments on the long BYU RLL thread for more information:
Having said all of the above, this doesn't feel like FS' greatest piece of design. I can see that BYU RLL aren't the only people who are accidentally (?) clearing the 'Reason This Source Is Attached'. Unfortunately I have found no way of telling whether a particular update was made via the API or via the FS user interface.
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P.S. Here are some examples:
Profile
Source
Change Date and Time
User making Change
Reason this Source is Attached
Tags put in place
G696-W2C
3JCQ-F2K
2022-02-10 20:12:32
(user 1)
Mentioned in death record of spouse.
http://gedcomx.org/Name
G696-W2C
3JCQ-F2K
2026-03-16 13:30:24
TreeBuilding Project
(cleared)
(no change)
G696-W2C
3JCQ-G58
2022-02-10 20:19:25
(user 1)
Birth record of child.
http://gedcomx.org/Gender,http://gedcomx.org/Name
G696-W2C
3JCQ-G58
2026-03-16 13:30:24
TreeBuilding Project
(cleared)
(no change)
G696-W2C
3JCQ-VBV
2022-02-10 20:15:40
(user 1)
Death record of child.
http://gedcomx.org/Gender,http://gedcomx.org/Name
G696-W2C
3JCQ-VBV
2026-03-16 13:30:24
TreeBuilding Project
(cleared)
(no change)
GDGZ-1JN
3N4Z-B5P
2022-01-17 00:19:56
(user 2)
Scotland Census, 1891
http://gedcomx.org/Birth,http://gedcomx.org/Gender,http://gedcomx.org/Name
GDGZ-1JN
3N4Z-B5P
2025-12-16 05:03:10
TreeBuilding Project
(cleared)
http://gedcomx.org/Birth,http://gedcomx.org/Death,http://gedcomx.org/Gender,http://gedcomx.org/Name
GH3V-KZ3
3MDH-KJY
2020-12-24 00:12:14
(user 3)
Confirms spouse as well as year and place of marriage.
http://gedcomx.org/Name
GH3V-KZ3
3MDH-KJY
2025-12-16 23:54:38
TreeBuilding Project
(cleared)
(no change)
GH3V-KZ3
3MDH-LDJ
2020-12-24 00:14:15
(user 3)
Confirms residence and family relationships in 1939.
http://gedcomx.org/Birth,http://gedcomx.org/Gender,http://gedcomx.org/Name
GH3V-KZ3
3MDH-LDJ
2025-12-16 23:54:38
TreeBuilding Project
(cleared)
(no change)
GH3V-KZ3
3MDH-PC5
2020-12-24 00:16:21
(user 3)
Confirms maiden name of mother.
http://gedcomx.org/Name
GH3V-KZ3
3MDH-PC5
2025-12-16 23:54:38
TreeBuilding Project
(cleared)
http://gedcomx.org/Birth,http://gedcomx.org/Name
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