In researching a family in Yorkshire, England. I found two separate baptism records for the same dau
and one had died. I can find no evidence of this, no death records or additional birth records for a second daughter. My question is, does this happen from time to time, someone being baptized more than once in the same church?
Answers
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I have found this also
The first child with the same name dies either the same day or close then when another child comes along they are given the same given name
Can be very confusing at times
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April
I have also come across instances where a child appears to have died, there is no recorded burial, yet another child is baptised a few years later with the same first name and parents. Generally, I would believe there have been two separate individuals involved. However, there are occasions when the first baptism was a "private" one - possibly carried out at home to a very sick child. The child then recovers an is then baptised "publicly" in the church. Also, a "second baptism" sometimes transpires to have a note alongside saying "received into the church" - though this does not always seem to mean a "confirmation" ceremony.
In summary, if you got the detail you describe from the original register it probably does mean the baptisms were for different children. However, if taken from an indexed record, there could be missing detail to explain something along the lines that I suggest - i.e. two baptisms for the same child.
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Paul,
Thank you for your explanation about the possibility of a double baptism. It would make sense. The family wasn't very good at baptizing their children soon after a child's birth so the idea that a child, who was sick could have been baptized and then recover does make sense.
Both baptism records were from parish registers. The latter baptism has no notes to indicate it was anything except a baptism. The only notes were the birth dates for the children written in the margins. The family had seven of their children baptized on the same day.
Another note about this family is in the 1901 census the mother recorded having given birth to thirteen children, which I have identified through census and birth records. I have ordered a number of birth records for children who were in question to verify they did belong to the family. With the birth years, of the children being approximately two years apart there just wasn't any space for a second child of the same name to have been born in the family. So I am left to assume this one daughter was possibly baptized twice.
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Good idea checking the census! Census records can be such a gold mine of information. It sounds like the census info, combined with the family's track record for when they baptized their children, is very good evidence that the daughter was baptized twice.
Also, now that I know about second baptisms, that's something I'll have to look out for in my own research! Good to learn!
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This is the fun (and frustrating) thing about British records. 1. Sometimes children were baptised/christened twice, years apart. Could be that the family forgot that they had had a child baptised, and then did it again when another child was baptised. Or, all the children were baptised at the same time, even those who had earlier been baptised separately. Or, a child was baptised when born (in a private baptism) and rebaptised again after the parents married or after nine months passed from the parents married. 2. Sometimes a child died and another was give the same name. Thus there could be baptism records for both children and it might be confusing as to whether there was one or two children of the same name.
Whenever possible, I look at the film of the original record because it often has more information written on it than what is on an index of the record. For instance, sometimes the birth date is written on the original baptism record. Sometimes the note that the baptism is a private baptism (and the reason, often marriage of parents or illegitimacy), and another date in the margin for the public baptism. Sometimes the death date is noted in the margin, especially if the infant died soon after birth or baptism.
When in doubt as to whether there is one or two children, I enter two separate children and write a note in the collaboration box that there is a possibliity (or proof of two children with the same name) to remind me and anyone else looking at the record of why there is or is not two children with the same name.
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Excellent advice. I appreciate these insights into baptisms, because I have run into a lot of situations in my English research where I find two baptism dates for a child's name with the same parents and baptized in the same place.
Sometimes the dates are far enough apart that they look like a subsequent child was given the same name as a deceased child. But sometimes the dates are too close to have been two separate children (for example, just a few months apart). I used to think that meant one of the baptism records just didn't belong to the family at all, but now I think they were likely cases of a private or re-baptism. Definitely something I'll keep in mind going forward.
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John,
Thanks for your insights. I agree that viewing the original records is necessary. I hadn't considered that the parents had forgotten about a baptism and then did it again. In this in particular case the child was baptised in 1870 and then in 1873 she along with seven of her siblings, were baptised all together. It may be she was sick as an infant, baptized, and then recovered as was suggested in Pauls post above. Then three years later the family decides to baptize all the children she was re-baptized. Thank you for helping me to think outside the box on this one.
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It's funny how, in researching records, sometimes we forget (or at least I forget) how the people attached to the records were, well, human! They got things wrong, they made mistakes, they forgot stuff, especially in times before things like birthdates and name spellings became important for official identity and security reasons. It does mean thinking outside the box a little when records don't seem to square up with what you "know" about a family.
For example, I spent years thinking my great-grandfather was born in 1912, because that was what he claimed his whole life and it was written on all of his vital records in adulthood. A few years ago I finally found the original digitized image for his state birth registration. It turned out his birth was registered in 1912, but he was actually born in 1909! In those days in Mexico, many families in rural communities did not bother hurrying to the nearest civic office to record a life event. For whatever reason, his parents finally got around to recording their son's birth when he was three. (Although, maybe if he was like my 2-year-old niece, they were just too exhausted to do much of anything for the first three years of his life.
) Somehow, by the time he was an adult filling out his papers for US naturalization, the 1912 date had gotten fixed in his head as his birth year.0 -
Teresa
so right
people forget things or just did not know
My Grandfather told me he was born 1880 in Birmingham UK & came to Canada when he was 9 or 10 with his brother
Turns out he was born in 1876 & he was 14 when he came with the Home Children scheme back in 1889
Even when he married he still thought he was younger than he actually was
Keep looking for the documentation sometimes it is not there but most of the time there is some record someplace
Lynda
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It did sometimes happen - but it is rare. Sometimes a private baptism/christening would be performed followed by a public one at a later date.
Now that said, that is the exception.
It was common in Europe (and England) that when one child died - a subsequent child would receive the same name. If this is the 1870's you can check the GRO birth and death records and see if there is another child.
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I am having this same issue: Worcester England 1900 both father and son have a daughter born naming her "Dorothy" also known as Dolly. Both Mothers first names are Mary Jane (one is Frost the other one is a Lerry) I am so confused. I have been working on this tree for like ever and the more I stare at it the more I see that 10 years ago I took a wrong turn and now have to figure out is this Dorothy the same girl? Did she just get caught on two different census one of her dads and the other her uncle?
I seriously do not know how to begin to fix it all. Any help would be appreciated 😇
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Have you checked the GRO?
If not can you send me the two ID's in Family Search? I am happy to take a quick look
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I am using Ancestry for my tree so I have control LOL
But I was so confused I started putting in the street & profession from the census for the head of the family & some others
it does help a bit as far as profession goes as they did not seem to change their job as much as they did their home address
I also check the children on the GRO birth index & find the right mother's surname
they did not seem to put Mother's names on some birth records
Lynda
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Danielle, many of us have done or found the same type of issue. When I find one or possibly two people co-miongled who have me confused, I take out a long piece of paper and write out all the source documents I have. Start with the 1901 census, then look for Dorothys and Dollys in the 1891 and 1911 census with the same parent names. Then look through the GRO, and the christening records, then marriage records, and the 1939 register, and death records. What you are looking for is two distinct Dorothys at the same time period living in the same area with same parent names. If you find that, then you try to separate the sources out for each Dorothy. With luck, you will be able to find out if there is enough information to flesh out two separate Dorothys. If you only have one record for one Dorothy, you may have an errant record for a single Dorothy and you should look at that record and see if it appears to be misrecorded. And, take advantage of RBowers offer below as it usually helps to have a second set of eyes to see if there is something you've missed. Good luck, this is one of the frustrating (and rewarding) challenges in doing geneological research.
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