Translation fr Polish marriage record - calculating birth year
Maria Eppich kindly discovered and helped translate this marriage record of Jan/Joannes Bieda L7FN-R9M and Katarzyna Tlucek 9F7Q-NMT, 23 Dec 1872. It states that Jan Bieda is a widower and (I think) 46 years old. If I calculate his birth year would be about 1826. If this is accurate, I need to calculate Jan Bieda's mother's approximate birth year, and find his (Jan Bieda's) first marriage.
Please help me be certain that this calculation of his birth year is correct, or if it might be included in the marriage record and I missed it. Thank you. Mattie
Note: We were researching this about 2 years ago after sorting out Piotr Bieda's birth records: Peter Bieda Birth Records (Parents Jan Bieda & Katarzyna Tluczek). https://szukajwarchiwach.pl/59/1240/0/-/10/skan/full/8hQqp26ZrJ3N4Usdflxgcg
Source: https://szukajwarchiwach.pl/59/1240/0/-/8/skan/full/8b9kMg9ZB5x5hG2DvH_-0w
Best Answers
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If you check Geneteka.genealodzy.pl, selecting podkarpackie and Lubenia, then entering Mateusz (Mathias, Matheus in Latin) Bida (a variation of Bieda) and Magdalena Zalot searching for marriages, you will find their marriage. You will need to go to szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl the following link, marriage scan 34 of 473 to find their marriage.
Marriage Record , Lubenia Parish, dated 23rd October 1825, of Matheus (Mateusz in Polish) Bida, House No. 129, 23 years old, bachelor, son of Valentinus (Walenty in Polish) Bida and of his wife Catharina (Katarzyna in Polish), born Wayda (or Wajda), and of Magdalena Zalot, 21 years old (also entered 18 in column for single, so she could be 23 yrs or 18 years old), daughter of Josephus (Jozef in Polish) Zalot and Marianna Zabecki, daughter of Thomas (Tomasz in Polish) Zabecki. Witnesses: Joannes (Jan in Polish) Wilk and Adalbertus (Wojciech in Polish) Bida, farmers.
Please keep in mind that they did not have written or printed IDs at that time, so the spelling often depended on pronunciation or what the recorder was used to write. Sorry, I was not able to attach the downloaded image of this marriage record.
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Thank you Maria. Your ability to translate and navigate these records is a tremendous help. Thank you for sharing with me the process, I have been trying to learn how to use the Polish archive site, and have more work to do. I sincerely appreciate it. Best wishes.
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Maria, your help allowed me to expand my family tree further back then I have ever been able to in eastern Europe. I was able to add source material to 8 individuals, 5 completely new, and strengthen the information for existing people in my family tree. Thank you. Mattie
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Matthie,
I have just noticed this birth record of Jan Bida.
FHL Micr. 008025990 Image 58 of 400
Birth record of Joannes (Jan) Bida, born in House No. 129, on the 6th May 1827, baptized on the 6th May 1827, son of Matheus (Mateusz) Bida, a farmer, and of Magdalena, born Zalot, daughter of Josephus (Jozef) Zalot. Godparents: Jacobus (Jakub) Buk and Catharina (Katarzyna), wife of Joannes (Jan) Wilk, farmers. Note on this birth record: Cross signifying death and date 18th July 1899.
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Maria--see next comment--thank you!
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Maria, Oh my goodness. Is Jan Bieda's Birth record in a digital format or microfilm?
That is a tremendous help.
I wondered how I could find out when he passed away.
Thank you for your extensive help!
Mattie
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Matthie,
The birth record of Jan Bida is in a digital form and may be accessible on Internet. Try to access it at home or at your nearby Family History Center. If you cannot open it due to restrictions by archives which let us microfilm it, please go to Lookup Service and request it:
- Familysearch.org/family-history-library
- Services
- Records Lookup Service
- Complete the Request Form at the bottom
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Maria,
I hope you realize how extraordinary and far reaching your help is to me and the people in this family tree! Thank you. I have been looking for this for over 20 years, or more; and my limitations have been my inability to read Polish and how to navigate the Polish archive sites without having a specific year and place to start with, or even when I do know. Thank you a million x a million. You are wonderful.
With gratitude,
Mattie
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Mattie,
It has been a pleasure to help you with your research. I am glad those records were accessible.
Best wishes for your research.
Maria Eppich
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Maria, I have been organizing a family history booklet for my nephew who is the Bieda line and his grandmother and I used to correspond. I made these for my own family in the USA years ago when I had made some progress as a way of thanking them. If I print this in Polish and include images they have shared with me along with images I have from my grandparents, basic family trees and FGS, is this an acceptable thing to do or should I ask them first? thanks. Mattie
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Maria-I heard back from the FHL regarding the microfilm of Jan Bida's birth and they cannot share it due to "Restrictions placed by the author/publisher/owners of the record do not allow us to provide the image that you requested" so I will cite the record using the microfilm # and page and that will still provide the much needed birth and death dates. I remain overjoyed at this finding!
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Maria--I have another translation question, when it states, "orphaned bride" (see below) it still includes father Kazimirierz Tluczek and Mother Marianna Przybos-so is Katarzyna Tluczek born of these (biological) parents?
Does the orphaned bride mean they passed away before her marriage? OR These are her guardian parents, legally but not biologically? Thank you, I just want to be certain. Mattie.
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"I was able to locate also the marriage record of parents of Piotr Bieda, Jan Bieda and Katarzyna Tluczek.
https://szukajwarchiwach.pl/59/1240/0/-/8/skan/full/8b9kMg9ZB5x5hG2DvH_-0w
Marriage Record No. 5, Lubenia Parish, dated 23rd December 1872, of Joannes (Jan in Polish) Bieda, House No. 129, a widower, 46 years old, a legitimate son of deceased Mathias (Maciej in Polish) Bieda and of Magdalena, born Zalot, farmers, he is a widower after death of Agnes (Agnieszka in Polish) Kubicka, and of Catharina (Katarzyna in Polish) Tluczek, 22 years old, a single lady, legitimate daughter of deceased Casimirus (Kazimierz in Polish) Tluczek and of deceased Marianna, born Przybos, married couple Tluczek. Witnesses: Joannes Tluczek, a farmer, and Simon (Szymon in Polish) Wilk, a grave digger.
The marriage banns were published on 29th September, 6th October, and 13th October, 1872. The consent for this marriage of the guardian of this orphaned bride was given on 21st October, 1872, No. 4332. "
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Mattie,
You are correct that the guardian of the bride is appointed because both of her parents passed away sometime before her marriage. It is usually an uncle or someone of the family.
As to the scan of the birth record of Jan Bida, could you check with your Family History Center in your neighborhood, as they may have access to it and make it available to you. Please check it out. You may access their address by going to:
- familysearch.org
- ? Help on the right hand side of screen
- next item below: Find Family History Center (enter postal zip code or the town)
Hope you can get it there.
Maria
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I think they would be glad to receive such family tree with their ancestors, connected to their family.
But you may send also corresponding Geneteka indexed records in Polish to make it easier for them to learn more about their ancestors. Most people only know their grandparents, as access to church records is more difficult.
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Great idea, I never thought of that.
Thanks for helping me make such extensive leaps and bounds with my family tree.
Best wishes,
Mattie
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Thank you Maria,
I sincerely appreciate your help and insights into sorting out these records, and the ideas about the family history booklet to share with my relatives in Lubenia. I am putting together a folder of what to include.
I did get a response back from the FHC and I have a copy of Joannes Bieda's birth record from there. I cannot tell you how much that has helped me sort out a major branch of my family tree. I cannot thank you enough.
Every good wish,
Mattie
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Answers
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Dear Maria, Very good. Thank you for explaining the orphaned bride. Yes, I will check with my local FHC, even if they cannot get it, I can probably get the full citation and use it as a secondary source. The information is still of great value.
Thank you Maria, for everything.
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Maria, What do you think about sending my relatives in Lubenia a family tree, if this is appropriate. thank you. Mattie.
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As to sending your family tree to your family, could you ask them about it? I think they would appreciate it. You may also ask them to make any additions or corrections. Most Polish families do not know much about their ancestors. Geneteka and Geneszukacz.genealodzy.pl helped many of them to spark their interest in researching their ancestors.
I am glad to help you and appreciate your comments.
Maria
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I am so glad you are having success with your Polish research.
Maria Eppich
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Maria,
Your discovery of Joannes Bieda's Birth record has helped identify and discover over 13 of his children I never knew of. Please know how much I appreciate this, and how this translates into the work of the gathering of Israel. Sincerely, Mattie.
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