I just joined family search today. I have FHL film numbers for a marriage 13 mar 1848 between John

LegacyUser

I just joined family search today.
I have FHL film numbers for a marriage 13 mar 1848 between John Painter and Mary Brookes in Old Swinford, Worcestershire, England.
How do I see/get copy of the record on family search using FHL number?
Thanks

Nvpattt

As to your original question, Open FamilySearch, Go to search, catalog, and there is a place for you to put your film number. Click on that and put in the film number. If your film is viewable, it should give you an index or more information about the film.

Brett .

@G MalcolmYOUNG​ 

.

Malcolm

.

Welcome to 'FamilySearch'.

I hope you enjoy and have success with 'FamilySearch'.

.

Now, with the information you provided ...

.

Here is the particular "Source", that you have attached, for the particular Film:

.

.

So, as indicated on the "Source", that Film can ONLY be access/viewed at a "Family History Centre" of the Church, around the World (and, possibly, a 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Library).

.

Now ...

That said ...

.

Many of the "Family History Centres" of the Church, around the World (and, possibly, a 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Library) are currently (still) TEMPORARILY "Closed" due to the "COVID-19" Pandemic.

.

Whereas, some of the "Family History Centres" of the Church, around the World (and, possibly, a 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Library) have re-opened.

.

To find your nearest "Family History Centres" of the Church, around the World (and, possibly, 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Libraries), you can look/search for it here:

.

Find a Family History Center and FamilySearch Affiliate Libraries

https://www.familysearch.org/help/fhcenters/locations/

.

IF, your closest "Family History Centres" of the Church, around the World (and, possibly, 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Libraries) are currently (still) TEMPORARILY "Closed" due to the "COVID-19" Pandemic; THEN, like many, you may have to wait until they re-open; OR, you could try for a "Family History Library" ( FHL) 'On-Line' Consultation.

.

Here is a 'link' to such consultations:

.

Family History Library Online Consultations

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/Family_History_Library_Online_Consultations

.

I hope this helps.

.

Brett

.

LegacyUser

Thanks, Brett, for a quick and precise reply. There is a family history centre not too far away, so will give it a go,

 

Bye

 

malcolm

 

A van Helsdingen

Just so you are aware, the collection "England Marriages 1538-1975" is part of what is called the International Genealogical Index (IGI). This is a sample of the world's genealogical records, made during the late 20th century.

The "image" that is accessible will not have much more information, if any, than the Index you have seen. It is not the original record that was written in 1848.

 

According to the FamilySearch Wiki page "England Church Records", the pay-to-use website "The Genealogist" has copies of the original church records from Worcestershire. FHCs may have subscriptions to that website.

 

For post-1837 records, the Civil marriage registers should also be consulted (see https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/England_Civil_Registration) . Note that for Anglican marriages this is an exact copy of the Church marriage record, so there is no need to do this if you have a copy of the church record.

 

I am happy to provide further assistance if you need it.

Brett .

@G MalcolmYOUNG​ 

.

Malcolm

.

A little bit more information here ...

So that you can get the WHOLE picture ...

.

The 'Collection' of "England Marriages 1538-1975" in 'FamilySearch' is NOT "... part of what is called the International Genealogical Index (IGI) ...".

.

The 'Description of the 'Collection' of "England Marriages 1538-1975" in 'FamilySearch' is:

.

------------------ 

Quote

Index to selected England marriages. Only a few localities are included and the time period varies by locality. Due to privacy laws, recent records may not be displayed. The year range represents most of the records. A few records may be earlier or later. Includes marriage banns.

------------------ 

.

Reference:

England Marriages, 1538–1973

https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1473015

.

Plus ...

That is further clarified ...

.

And, ... the 'Collection' MAY include information previously published in the "International Genealogical Index" (IGI).

.

Reference:

England Marriages - FamilySearch Historical Records 

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/England_Marriages_-_FamilySearch_Historical_Records 

.

There is a significant difference between, "is part of"; and, "may include" ...

.

So...

That said ...

.

I would suggest that the particular 'Collection' of "England Marriages 1538-1975" in 'FamilySearch' most likely contains, both, some actual/original "Records"; and, also MAY include some data from the "International Genealogical Index" (IGI).

.

Therefore ...

.

Please do not dismiss that collection on the basis that the collection may contain/include some data from the "International Genealogical Index" (IGI).

.

And, I will send to a (Private) 'Message' through this Forum.

.

Brett

. 

A van Helsdingen

Is there a difference between the "Extraction Program" of the late 20th century and the IGI? I always thought they were similiar or at least related. My understanding up to this point was that "legacy" collections such as "England Marriages 1583-1975" contained mostly records from the extraction program, plus a few names submitted by Latter Day Saints, and formed part of the IGI.

 

According to: https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1473015 and the Wiki page for this collection, there are no images. So it is unusual that a user is being told to visit a FHC or Affiliate Library to view them.

 

It is stressed by those pages that this collection contains only a small sample of all the records. This collection may therefore be a good place to start, for those lucky enough to have ancestor's marriage's mentioned, but researchers should ALWAYS seek the original images, either through another FS Historical Records Collection or some other source.

 

I am only trying to be helpful to a new user of FS. I would not them to drive to a FHC or Affiliate Library only to find that there is no original image.

 

 

 

 

 

Brett .

@A van Helsdingen​ 

.

In reference to "Legacy" Collections ...

.

'FamilySearch' "Wiki"

FamilySearch Historical Record Collections

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/FamilySearch_Historical_Record_Collections#Legacy_Collections

.

Where it clearly states:

Quote

------------------ 

Legacy Collections

.

Some of the older Historical Records collections were assembled for publication in April 2010.  These were compiled from indexing projects completed by volunteers from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and other organizations. These projects were not designed to index all available records for a given location.  Therefore, they are incomplete.  Since publication in 2010 only a few records may have been added.  As no additional records will be added, or any corrections made to the data, these are considered to be "Legacy" collections.

.

Please be aware of the following:

.

•  Data in the collection may have been subject to multiple post-indexing treatments which changed the originally indexed values or added data which was not indexed

.

•  The indexing project may have had indexing instructions significantly different from those currently used in projects for the same locality

.

•  As with all computer data files, some data may have become corrupted over time

.

Some of the records in these collections may have been included in the former International Genealogical Index (IGI).  As these collections are an index compiled from various sources, it is strongly recommended that you verify any information you find with original records.  Due to privacy laws not all records may be displayed.

------------------ 

.

So ...

That said ...

.

Please do not confuse the data from, "International Genealogical Index" (IGI) [and/or, the "Records Extraction Program"] of the Church, that MAY be included in the 'Collection' of "England Marriages 1538-1975" in 'FamilySearch', with the ACTUAL Records obtained from Record "Custodians" that do appear in that 'Collection'.

.

And ...

As previously stated ...

.

It is clearly stated in the 'Description' of the 'Collection' of "England Marriages 1538-1975" in 'FamilySearch':

.

Quote

------------------ 

Index to selected England marriages. Only a few localities are included and the time period varies by locality.  Due to privacy laws, recent records may not be displayed.  The year range represents most of the records.  A few records may be earlier or later.  Includes marriage banns.

------------------ 

.

Reference:

England Marriages, 1538–1973

https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1473015

.

Plus ...

That is further clarified ...

.

And, ... the 'Collection' MAY include information previously published in the "International Genealogical Index" (IGI).

.

Reference:

'FamilySearch' "Wiki"

England Marriages - FamilySearch Historical Records 

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/England_Marriages_-_FamilySearch_Historical_Records 

.

Now ...

That said ...

.

It DOES NOT state or indicate in, either, the 'Collection' in 'FamilySearch'; and/or, the associated 'FamilySearch' "Wiki' page/screen, for the 'Collection' of "England Marriages 1538-1975" that "... there are no images '' in that 'Collection'.

.

But ...

In the "Wiki' page/screen it states:

Quote

------------------

Image Visibility

.

Whenever possible FamilySearch makes images and indexes available for all users.  However, rights to view these data are limited by contract and subject to change.  Because of this there may be limitations on where and how images and indexes are available or who can see them.  Please be aware some collections consist only of partial information indexed from the records and do not contain any images.

.

For additional information about image restrictions see 'Restrictions for Viewing Images in FamilySearch Historical Record Collections'.

------------------

.

So ...

That said ...

.

I would humbly suggest that there are at least SOME "Images" of ACTUAL Records obtained from Record "Custodians" in the 'Collection' of "England Marriages 1538-1975" in 'FamilySearch'; but, they MAY be subject to "Restricted" access/viewing - ie. ONLY accessible/viewable in "Family History Centres" of the Church, around the World (and, possibly, a 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Libraries, around the World) .

.

'Yes', it IS certainly stated that in regard to the 'Collection' of "England Marriages 1538-1975" in 'FamilySearch' that:

.

•  Only a few localities are included and the time period varies by locality; and, that; and,

•  Again ... This index is not complete for any particular place, region or time period; and,

•  Furthermore, the ... collection may include information previously published in the "International Genealogical Index" (IGI).

.

And, 'Yes', the 'Collection' of "England Marriages 1538-1975" in 'FamilySearch' is certainly a good place to start ...

.

Regardless of whether or not one finds one's Ancestors records there ...

.

And, 'Yes', of course, one should ALWAYS seek out the ORIGINAL "Records" (and, "Images") where one can ...

.

If, one has, both, the 'Time'; and, the 'Ability' (and, not to mention the 'Funds') ...

.

Regardless of where that may be ... 

.

But, 'FamilySearch' is a good place to start; and, most importantly ... it is FREE ...

.

NOT everyone has the funds to seek out and obtain such from, "Subscription" (ie. "Paid") websites; and/or, the Record "Custodians" that change a "Fee".

.

I likewise would not want Users/Patrons to go to a [ their nearest ] "Family History Centre" of the Church (and, possibly, 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Library) only to find that there are NO "Images" for a particular "Indexed" record ...

.

But ...

That said ...

.

I, like many regular Users/Patrons, who participate in the 'FamilySearch' ("GetSatisfaction") 'Feedback' Forum, am aware ...

.

That "Indexed" Records (and, "Images") come and go from 'FamilySearch' on a continual basis ...

.

Sometimes, there one time; and, then gone the next ... 

.

They may be there when you notice the "Record" in 'FamilySearch'; but, be gone by the time you get around to going to a "Family History Centre" of the Church (and, possibly, 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Library) - such is life.

.

[ Whereas, regardless, the "Family History Centres" of the Church (and, possibly, 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Libraries), are STIIL a GREAT place to go, for (General) HELP and ASSISTANCE, regardless if one does not find the "Images" of particular records for one's Ancestors that one is seeking - most importantly for "Family History Centres" of the Church - it is FREE, with free access to a number of "Subscription" (ie. "Paid") websites. ] 

.

And, there are many and varied "Reasons" WHY "Indexed" Records (and, "Images") come and go from 'FamilySearch' ...

.

Furthermore ...

.

Naturally, during the TEMPORARILY "Closure" of the "Family History Centres" of the Church, around the World (and, possibly, the 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Libraries, around the World), due to the "COVID-19" Pandemic, we (ie. those who participate in this "Community.FamilySearch" Forum) CANNOT provide EVERY individual User/Patron who desires access to "Restricted" Records, that are only accessible/viewable at "Family History Centres" of the Church, around the World (and, possibly, the 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Libraries, around the World), with direct HELP (and, especially, not access to those "Records").

.

Brett

.

A van Helsdingen

The paragraph about Image Visibility on the Wiki page is a standard template added to the pages about Historical Records Collection.

 

If you see this example of a non-legacy collection, it states how many images are in the collection. https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1462403 There is no such statement for the England Marriages 1538-1975 https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1473015

 

My own experience working with legacy collections at FS over the years is that there are never any images.

 

I don't want to argue this any longer, so I will be starting a Talk on the Wiki page, asking that if the collection is index-only, that a FHL employee (who are the only ones authorised to make edits relating to restrictions on access to records), removes the template about Image Visibility and clarifies that the collection is index-only.

 

LATER EDIT: The list of historical record collections for England states this collection has no images, see: https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/list/?cqs=England

 

Here is the talk page: https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/Talk:England_Marriages_-_FamilySearch_Historical_Records

Brett .

@A van Helsdingen​ 

.

No argument here.

.

Hopefully, all things equal, I will be going to my local "Family History Centres" of the Church this coming Monday (ps: its now Saturday night - our time); and, I should be able to 'confirm' either way, whether or not, there is an "Image" associated with the "Indexed" record that is the subject of this 'Question' of 'Malcolm'.

.

And, hence, whether or not, there are ANY "Images" associated with the 'Collection' of "England Marriages 1538-1975" in 'FamilySearch'

.

And, hopefully, IF, there are; THEN, there will be NO need to amend that 'FamilySearch' "Wiki" page.

.

So ...

Stay tuned ...

.

Brett

.

Brett .

@A van Helsdingen​ 

.

FYI

.

Update ...

.

An "Image" associated with the "Indexed" record that is the subject of this 'Question' of 'Malcolm' IS available to access/view at a "Family History Centre" of the Church.

.

Furthermore ...

.

What is stated on the 'FamilySearch' "Wiki" page

England Marriages - FamilySearch Historical Records 

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/England_Marriages_-_FamilySearch_Historical_Records 

IS correct.

.

Quote

------------------

Image Visibility

.

Whenever possible FamilySearch makes images and indexes available for all users.  However, rights to view these data are limited by contract and subject to change.  Because of this there may be limitations on where and how images and indexes are available or who can see them.  Please be aware some collections consist only of partial information indexed from the records and do not contain any images.

.

For additional information about image restrictions see 'Restrictions for Viewing Images in FamilySearch Historical Record Collections'.

------------------

.

So, that 'FamilySearch' "Wiki" page DOES NOT need changing; as, there ARE "Images" associated with some of those 'Collections'.

.

Brett

.

A van Helsdingen

Is the image from the FS extraction program or from an "original" record? Does it contain any additional information not found in the Index?

 

The List of Historical Record Collections says that this collection and other "legacy" collections have no images. https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/list/?cqs=England (e.g. England Deaths and Burials 1538-1991).

 

I will update the "Talk" on the Wiki page. Hopefully a Wiki editor who is authorised to make edits regarding restrictions on access to records will respond soon and resolve the confusion.

Brett .

@A van Helsdingen​ 

.

'NO', the particular "Image" that is the subject of this particular 'Question' is certainly NOT part of the "International Genealogical Index" (IGI) [and/or, the "Records Extraction Program"].

.

And, 'NO', not really, nothing much; except, that on any page from a "Marriage" Register of 'Established Church' (ie, in this case, the 'Church of England') - which is NORMAL for "Indexed" records for everywhere.

.

You are INCORRECT, that "Historical Record Collections" specifically for "England" DOES, in fact, indicate that there ARE "Images" associated with those 'Collections' - See the "Camera" 'Icons" ...

.

https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/list/?cqs=England

.

[ And, this is even NOT being "Signed" to 'FamilySearch' ]

.

.

Please DO NOT (unnecessarily) update the "Talk" on that "Wiki".

.

There is NO need for the "Editor" to authorise any such "Change" regarding "Restrictions" and access to such "Restrictions"; as, there message is quite clear and concise - there is NO confusion.

.

It is simply a matter that Users/Patrons WANT access (from Home) to "Restricted" Records that can ONLY be accessed/viewed at "Family History Centres" of the Church, around the World (and, possibly, 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Libraries, around the World) - that is 'human nature'.

.

Remember: Even I; as, a Member of the Church, needed to go to a "Family History Centre" of the Church to access/view the particular "Image" in question - so, non-members are not alone.

.

Please DO NOT waste the valuable time of those at 'FamilySearch' - they have other MORE important work to be undertaking.

.

'Thank You' in advance.

.

Brett

.

A van Helsdingen

Can I check we are "on the same page" here? We are talking about the legacy collection "England Marriages 1538-1975". We are NOT talking about any other collections from England.

 

 

In the list of Historical Record Collections that I see from my account there is NO camera symbol beside the collection "England Marriages 1538-1975". That is supposed to mean that the collection is index-only.

 

My experience working with legacy collections on FS is that they are always index-only.

 

I will keep the Talk page, because I am not authorized to make these edits. If the collection DOES have images, then not only that page but many other Wiki pages will need to be corrected to state that legacy collections (or at least some of them) have images as well as an index.

 

 

Brett .

@A van Helsdingen​ 

I give up ...

You would prefer waste your time; and, the valuable time of that of those at 'FamilySearch' ...

Rather than accept that there ARE "Images" associated with the 'Collection' of England Marriages, 1538–1973

https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1473015

Accessible/viewable at "Family History Centres" of the Church (and, possibly, a 'FamilySearch' Affiliate Libraries).

I will not waste my time on this matter any longer.

Brett

ps: Please DO NOT respond any further on this matter.

LegacyUser

Thanks for all the input- I now will work through what you say and if I have any questions, I will get back to you.

 

Best regards

 

malcolm