Norwegian Names - A recurring problem
My wife came across this post today in the Facebook group "Slektsforskning med FamilySearch i Norge" (Family History Research with FamilySearch in Norway):
Hei,
Kan noen som har kontakter i FamilySearch / LDS vær så snill å hjelpe oss å få endret normen for gårdsnavn i Norge? Jeg begynner å se at ivrige "hjelpere" sletter flere gårdsnavn-etternavn, og de har tydeligvis reglene på sin side - fordi den som skrev reglene ikke visste noe om slektsforskning i Norge!
Gårdsnavn ER "ekte" etternavn, selv om de ikke var arvelige og selv om folk kunne endre dem gjennom livet. Det er en misforståelse at det bare var en "adresse". Mange, både fattige og rike, beholdt gårdsnavnet som etternavn selv om de flyttet til en annen gård.
Alle slektshistoriske bøker i Norge bruker gårdsnavn-etternavn i tillegg til patronymer. Alle sider der norske slektsforskere får styre seg selv (inkl. Geni, WIkiTree og Historisk Befolkningsregister) bruker gårdsnavn frimodig. Uten gårdsnavn blir det håpløst å skille alle som heter Ole Hansen eller Ane Olsdatter.
My translation:
Hello,
Can someone who has contacts in FamilySearch/LDS please help us to get the standards for farm-name surnames in Norway changed? I have begun to see that enthusiastic "helpers" are erasing many farm-name surnames and they clearly have the rules on their side - because whoever wrote the rules did not know anything about family history research in Norway!
Farm-names ARE "real" surnames even though they were not inherited and even though people could change them during their lives. It is a misunderstanding to say that they were just an "address." Many, both poor and rich, maintained their farm-name surname even if they moved to a different farm.
All family history books in Norway use farm-name surnames in addition to patronymics. All webpages that Norwegian family history researchers personally manage (including Geni, WikiTree, and the Historical Population Register) use farm names widely. Without farm-name surnames, it is a hopeless endeavor to distinguish between everyone that was named Ole Hansen or Ane Olsdatter.
This is a recurring problem. I have submitted corrections to the Help Center article and the Research Wiki article about Norwegian naming traditions and surnames a few times over the years and these have always been rejected. As more and more Norwegians get acquainted with FamilySearch Family Tree and use it for documenting their ancestors, many will just give up and leave the platform if proper Norwegian name entry keeps getting edited away by users who are following incorrect instructions or who continue to be mislead by the myth that Norwegians only used patronymics.
We will let this gentleman know that the best thing to do at this point is to follow critical profiles, keep putting the correct names back in whenever they are removed, message the users making the changes, and to keep teaching proper name entry.
But it would be very beneficial to get the help articles corrected. What can be done? Submitting corrections to the articles through the suggested form has not helped to this point.
Answers
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I assume that the Research Wiki article you are referring to is: Norway Naming Customs. That article says "Farm names indicate residence, and should be recorded as part of the event locality - not as a surname," which is certainly advice contrary to what you posted above.
But I am unable to find the Help Center article you are referring to. Could you please provide a link?
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The Help Center article is: with the statement "Enter farm names as part of the event place-name, not as part of the last name." This is incorrect.
As the Norwegian Archives states, "Norwegian names today are composed of a first and last name, as in other western countries, but in the 19th century, a name acted as an important clue to someone’s place on the family tree. The typical 19th century Norwegian name would be composed of three parts: The given name, the patronymic and the farm name. Let’s take an example and break it down: Peder Johnsen Berg, a typical Norwegian farmer of the 1800s." See:
It can be seen in records from the 18th century that this three part name was also used then. However sometimes the records in that time period and earlier do just have two parts such as Peder Berg. Norwegian names really are quite complicated. I can post my full explanation again if anyone wants to read it.
The three part name was very common. The article states that historically 80% of the population of Norway had farm-name last names. This article is a bit unique in that it reserves the term "surname" for a fixed, inherited last name and takes the standpoint that Norwegians prior to about 1900 did not have last names but had just a first name and then the addition of a patronymic and a farm name which were both used to clarify who they were. I haven't run across anyone else that takes such a strict viewpoint on surnames. Most people view everything after the first names as surnames.
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@Gordon Collett said "...Most people view everything after the first names as surnames"
Absolutely. My interest in Scandinavian names is just for personal "amusement". However, I have a closer interest in Welsh names, which were once patronymic. I have seen similar disagreement in FS over where Welsh patronyms should go - one person was convinced that patronyms should not go into the surname but into the first name item. For instance, "ap Twdr" (spelling not guaranteed) - which means "son of Tudor" - should, in their view, go into the first name item and the surname item should be left blank. (Having said that, I remain unclear whether searching does actually distinguish given and family names)
This is linked, I suggest, because what's missing is a published decision that the "surname" - or whatever we call it - needs to be a flexible concept and not confined to fixed, heritable names.
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Now exactly how to enter these full names into Family Tree is a different question. Years ago I tried to do some testing and the Find and Possible Duplicate routines seemed to work best if there was a single name in the Last Name field. I don't know if that is still true. So what I do is in the First Name field put Given-Name Patronymic (if they used a patronymic) and in the Last Name Field put Inherited/Aquired-Fixed-Patronymic or Farm-Name or Inherited-Surname. If the person did not have any additional names then I do put the Patronymic in the Last Name field instead of the First name Field.
Type of name: First Name Field — Last Name Field
- Inherited/Acquired Fixed Patronymic: Anna — Andersen (Her family was middle class and her father was Jon Andersen)
- Farm Name: Anna Andersdatter — Dale (Her family was upper middle class and she or her father owned Dale farm)
- Inherited Surname: Anna Andersdatter — Rusting (Her family was upper classes and has used the last name of Rusting for generations)
- No additional names: Anna — Andersdatter (Her family was lower class and in particular did not own any land and her father was Anders Jonsson)
Geni has specific instructions to put patronymics in the First Name field if the person had an addition last name or in the Last Name field if the person did not. When I ran across those instruction it was nice to see that this was what I already doing in my desktop program and in Family Tree. Some genealogy software has a specific field for patronymics. What I have seen some people do is put the patronymic in the Last Name field and the Farm Name in the Suffix field which is a terrible idea because all Find, Hint, and Possible duplicates routines ignore the suffix.
Since FamilySearch indexed records rarely include anything but the patronymic, so that hinting works well I do put the shortened form of the person's name consisting of just first name and patronymic in as an Alternate Name with the patronymic in the Last Name field. I don't know if this is really necessary these days for those routines but it does cut down on consistency flags in the Data Quality Score routine.
As you can see above, part of the complaint about refusing to use the proper name for a person is that you are thereby stripping them of part of their identity and their standing in society.
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I have been informed that the English version of this issue has now been corrected. Updates for the remaining languages will be released as soon as their translations are reviewed and approved.
FamilySearch sincerely appreciates you bringing this to our attention. Reports like yours help us identify gaps and improve the experience for all users. Thank you for taking the time to help make FamilySearch better for everyone.
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@sc woz Great news! I've read through the help center article ( See: ) and it is now correct. The Research Wiki article for Norwegian Names is still a mess though with too much wrong information (See: https://www.familysearch.org/en/wiki/Norway_Naming_Customs ) and contradicts the new information in the help center article. Can the wiki article please be corrected as well? I still have my version in a file if sending it in again would be helpful. Just tell me where to send it.
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The FamilySearch Research Wiki is maintained by separate FamilySearch staff and the Wiki Administration team, with support from assigned missionaries and trained volunteers.
If you notice outdated information or have suggestions for improvement, you’re welcome to submit them through the “Submit Wiki Content / Report a Problem” link on the Wiki. Those submissions go directly to the team responsible for reviewing and updating pages.
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