Active Population of Community Users?
I wonder how the community is doing as far as recently active community users.
(the actual count of users over the last few years for example)
I just get the impression we dont have as many active users as we once had.
and I really get the impression things could be alot higher than they currently are if certain steps were taken . . .
Wonder what the impression of the rest of you is.
I also wonder what FS leadership is doing to make more people aware of the community and making it more of use and of benefit to FS users.
Answers
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It is basically a question and answer forum but it seems to me that many, many users are only interested in asking questions rather than looking for answers.
Those few regulars (I agree) are answering the same questions over and over and over again. “Why can someone else mess with MY TREE?”, “How do I add my spouse/child using their ID?”, “ Why has my great uncle who died in the Middle East now been marked ‘Confidential’?”, “How do I add parents that weren’t married?”, and many more. When ordinary users of the site are keeping cut’n’paste answers for these questions then I’m not surprised that some don’t even bother at all.
How about having to have searched, and at least scanned the first 10 results, before being allowed to ask a question? I said that In jest, but now that I think about it ...
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I just think the community has a huge potential - but is tapping only a small percentage of that potential for some obvious and other not so obvious reasons.
Yeh the same few people - answering the same few questions . . .
and then you have people that ask a question - and never come back to see the answer . . .
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I’m never sure if they didn’t come back for the answer, or just couldn’t be bothered to say “Thanks”.
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I wonder to what extent people get baffled by the way that the Community presents its output. And baffled by where to ask questions.
Take the Groups feature, specifically 3 of the 5 Groups that I'm a member of - "British Isles Research", "England Research" and "Scotland Research". Why do we have the latter two when the first already covers them? Or vice versa, of course.
Then the Community Front Page ( https://community.familysearch.org/en/ ) shows "FamilySearch Help", "Suggest An Idea" and "Groups" across the top of the page. But there's also "Trending Discussions", "Answer A Question" and "Announcements" below. Are those separate areas, additional to the three at the top? Where do people go to ask questions or whatever? And if I click "View All" at the bottom of "Trending Discussions", I see yet another list - this one is called "Recent Discussions" rather than "Trending Discussions" even though the latter is what I think I'm expanding.
I think that the number of areas has indeed reduced over time but it still is, err, challenging.
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I say that because usually we are asking for more details that they never end up providing.
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yeh even for us long timers . . . there are a lot of baffling questions . . . .
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Forums and bulletin boards have been around since the very earliest days of the internet (remember newsgroups?), so you'd think people would've figured 'em out by now, but they demonstrably haven't -- neither on the programming end nor on the user end.
Part of the problem, both generally and on FS specifically, is that there is simply too much variation involved. On FS, there are many ways of arriving in the Community, screen size and OS/browser variations cause differences in the interface, and a different choice of words can lead to a completely different search experience. That last factor means that any attempt at requiring people to look before they ask is utterly futile. Many of them have looked, but the search didn't find them anything even remotely close. (And many others are simply too lost to translate another person's experience to their own. They need the answer in terms of their Uncle George, not someone else's Aunt Susie.)
I, too, wonder how the currently active "population" compares to the old GetSat forum and its predecessors.
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I think most people GAVE UP on the forums and boards a long time ago - for some obvious reasons if you actually have tried using those groups. (BUT There is great potential - we just never seem to even come close to that potential)
Contrastingly years back - under the leadership of Community Leader Carolyn Webber - we had great success in that area - things were really growing and I had great hopes - but when she abruptly left it went down hill and never recovered since - - - we have been through like 5 Community Leaders since Carolyn - without it ever being the same . . . we just seem to go through the same cycle community leader after community leader - each leader serving until they get burnt out and then the community going through a period of neglect - until they find someone else - who doesnt know the challenges they will face . . . and the real needs of the community never really being addressed.
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You said ". . . and the real needs of the community never really being addressed." Would you mind sharing what you think those real needs are, and how you think they should be addressed?
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Ive brought my ideas up directly with FS leadership (often on a one on one basis) again and again and again over the past like 6 years with each new set of FS Community leaders. FS community leadership is a revolving door . . . . and each new leader virtually starts from scratch. There has VERY RARELY ever been a smooth transition of leadership.
Each time it sounds like there will be some real change - - real improvement, but every time after a period of activity we end up the same boat as people come and go. The community also never seems to be given the resources it needs nor a stable set of leaders that will carry thru more than a year or so at time.
To its credit - FamilySearch has millions of users . . . and is subsidized by millions (probably more than a BILLION) dollars - It should be the GOLD standard in genealogy and family history, sadly so often it is not. It has indeed made some improvements over the years - but the community portion of FS has never been on anyone's priority list and it very much shows. In my humble opinion the Community COULD easily have 20-100 times the traffic and volume it currently gets - were it not for all the past "baggage" that it carries - all the bad taste in people's mouths of what has happened - or not happened - over the past decade - So many people just "gave up" on the community. As an example The entire "groups section" really has no user base - and has been HALF DEAD for years now - again leaving a bad taste in people mouth that they don't come back. Better to shoot a dead horse then let it suffer. . . The groups section has been half dead for years now - people making promises that it would eventually get better - with no real action ever seen.
I have given some very concrete and practical ideas in the past to FS leader - and whenever I did share my feelings with leadership - they usually AGREED with my comments. . . and I assume had real intentions of correcting things - it just always seems that the people who want to make things better often find their hands are tied by upper leadership who are really making the decisions.
I could rattle off numerous pain points and corresponding suggested improvements. . BUT frankly if FS Leadership cant see what is blatantly wrong - and take action - and wont give the community the real long term resources they need - than Its all a mute point.
If you are LDS - (and not everyone is - and thats perfectly fine) (I am LDS by the way) - BUT FS Leaders are virtually all LDS - and they, as LDS, believe this is the "Lords work" we are involved in - - I truly wish I could see the community managed the way He would manage it . . . I wonder some times - how things would be different if the Lord was leading the community . . . but no matter if you are LDS or not - whether a believer or not - - - FamilySearch really needs to raise the bar and raise the expectation and set the Gold Standard - and that also means funding it with the needed resources and stopping the vicious cycle of continually reinventing the community with each new set of FS leaders and top tier volunteers - that reset every year or so as their service mission comes to an end. and tying their hands from accomplishing what so often they really would like to accomplish because they dont control the resources.
Its really kind of sad that there is more community continuity and historical knowledge from a few people who have been here for years now - even if they are not even holding formal positions (like me and various others) and this same set of users I am alluding to know so much much more about the history and "baggage" of the past 6-7 years of the community - than do the actual FS paid employees and formal volunteers themselves. . . But each new leader comes along - and doesnt realize all the history and then wonders why things turn out the way they do - when they dont realize why so many people have given up on the community some time ago . . .
I have had great hopes and expectations for the community - I really have!!. . . and every time I have had a one on one with a new FS leader - and I have always shared my willingness to be part of the solution. I think that was very evident in my past dealings with FS leaders and they knew of my sincerity and the legitimate nature of the things I brought up. But the vicious cycle of a community that is only a very small fraction of what it could be - that never really seems to get off the ground - seems to be a cycle no one seems to find a way to escape from.
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You have raised a really interesting topic for discussion, but I did get a little lost in your last post - particularly by your not directly responding to the question from Alan E Brown of, "Would you mind sharing what you think those real needs are, and how you think they should be addressed?"
Instead, you said, "I could rattle off numerous pain points and corresponding suggested improvements. . BUT frankly if FS Leadership cant see what is blatantly wrong - and take action - and wont give the community the real long term resources they need - than Its all a mute point."
For me, this then turned what might be a genuine way of having a discussion amongst Community members on "the way forward" into a negative stance of, "Why suggest improvements, when the Leadership is already aware of what's wrong" - through your already having told them, over the years.
This is purely a personal reaction, I admit, but having raised such a good discussion point I have to say I am a little disappointed that you haven't provided at least a few "bullet points", which we could either agree, or disagree, would represent a positive way forward in leading to greater participate in - as well as improved quality of - this forum.
Nevertheless, your topic has still provided some excellent points being raised by other members (as well as yourself) about the way Community currently operates, its faults, possible decline in user participation, as well as the question of how many people come here specifically to answer issues, as opposed to those who just come to ask them.
If you could elaborate on one point, however: what resources do you feel are needed to help bring about improvement here? Are they financial, or would you suggest (say) FamilySearch employees should participate, at least to the same level as they did on the GetSat forum? Regarding the latter, perhaps many FS users are discouraged from coming here (or at least coming back) by their not receiving a response that could / can only be provided by someone "in the know". As with many FS users, I would never press for time frames in which a problem might be addressed - or a new feature / enhancement implemented - but I would expect to know, in terms of FamilySearch's plans, if a matter raised here is, or ever will be, in the pipeline.
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I have no intent of pursuing this thread any further - after this current post.
and though Alan did ask the question which triggered my response. I really didnt know if he was a FS employee or just some casual user. My response was really meant to be directed to FS leaders - my apologies for venting that on Alan.
Truth is - few people have been more of a cheerleader of the Community than I have over the past 6 or so years. I used to be an non-official direct support to one of the past community leaders like 5 years ago. and I have always wanted to see the Community reach its potential. and I still do. I also use to be the group leader for about TEN of the community groups (even not being a FS employee or missionary)
I have had a pretty good relationship with most all of the past Community Leaders - and when I have had serious conversations with them about the pain points of the Community - more than one of them said I was "spot on" and they saw the need for change same as I did . . . . and yet like I said - we just keep going around in a circle and not really making any long term progress - and much of the "baggage" of the past has caused so many people to just give up on the community - when in reality they were super users that had so much to contribute and now we don't have their support.
I really have some serious doubts about the community ever coming close to its potential (which I think is huge) - Like I said there are so many people (employees and service missionaries) at FS Community that want to do good and want to see success - but all so often find their hands tied by those at levels above them.
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I refer other users to the Community all the time. However, I often will answer their questions in the places they ask them. Those users are comfortable asking and conversing in other places because they frequent those online locations daily and there are tens of thousands of other users also in those same places daily. So to get a quick answer, it is most often easiest to go where you know there are other people already doing the same thing you are doing.
Trying to switch those users from where they are comfortable to a new platform is a long process. I tried it solid for a year. Then decided just to answer them where they ask and refer to this location when necessary.
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