How do I acertain the right person in particular record ?
I wasn't sure how to ask this question?
And I accept if there is not answer.
However I find it very odd that many British records that I look at have so little information. It seems almost useless as to why the records were kept.
Case in point.
Here you have a listing of births in 1884. As you look at any name it gives, the name of the person, who was born, then District, Vol. and Page.
But it doenst give me the parents name or address or anything that would help me identify if this is the Herbert Wilfred Hall that Im looking for.
How can I take this info and find out if it is who Im looking for?
Thanks.
Best Answers
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Seriously, you need to learn a bit more about genealogy for England & Wales. I'd hope the FamilySearch Wiki would help in this respect - I can't confirm because I've never looked at it from that level.
"I find it very odd that many British records that I look at have so little information. It seems almost useless as to why the records were kept"
You have to understand that those are not the detailed records - that's why they don't contain much. They are indexes to those records - what you're looking at is a page from the indexes that give the references to order the detailed record.
You're actually missing a crucial bit - which quarter of 1884 it was. According to FreeBMD (https://www.freebmd.org.uk - I'm using that because I know it better than the FS stuff) the entry in question is:
Births Mar 1884 (aka Q1 1884)
Hall Herbert Wilfrid
Pontypridd (Registration District)
Volume 11a Page 385
Using those details you can order the birth certificate in question from the GRO (see URL below) which will contain the full details including the parents' names - the contents of those BCs are NOT available online nor are they free anywhere. However, it is possible to squeeze a bit more out of free indexes.
1. Go to the GRO's own site https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/login.asp (registration is necessary but free)
2. Choose Search the GRO Indexes
3. Choose options for births and 1884
4. Enter surname, first forename, male, district of birth (Pontypridd), and hit Search.
5. I got just one entry:
Name: Mother's Maiden Surname:
HALL, HERBERT WILFRID PERRY
GRO Reference: 1884 M Quarter in PONTYPRIDD Volume 11A Page 385
It's the same info as FreeBMD but now we also know that his mother's maiden name was Perry. This may help - particularly if FreeBMD only has one Hall / Perry marriage in the previous 20 years or so. Which is PROBABLY the case, thus:
Marriages Sep 1874 (>99%)
HALL James Pontypridd 11a 517
Then click on the page number to see all 4 entries
Marriages Sep 1874 (>99%)
HALL James Pontypridd 11a 517
Lewis Joan Pontypridd 11a 517
Perry Sarah Ann Pontypridd 11a 517
Williams Abraham Pontypridd 11a 517
WARNING it is possible that James Hall married Joan Lewis. But given that we know there should be a Hall / Perry marriage, you should be looking at censuses for this family to check if these are the right names. So with any luck, Herbert Hall's parents were James Hall and Sarah Ann Perry...
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Good overview from @Adrian Bruce1 . One other piece that may be helpful. Baptisms are sometimes less tightly guarded than birth records. Both Ancestry and Find My Past have some baptismal records from the area. FamilySearch also has some, but I believe they can only be viewed at an Affiliate or FSC. Using the information from a birth index, you may be able to find a matching baptism with considerably more information.
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Answers
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Short answer: corroborating/additional records.
Longer answer: You are correct. Alone those records are not sufficient to establish a profile/identity. From your reference to the source it is difficult to determine - but since each line references a Volume - this indicates that it is an index to another volume of corresponding records.
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Thank you for your answer. Short and long answer.
I think if there is any moto for Genealogies its" Seldom is anything easy or straightforward."
Yes I saw those references, how do you see those pages which may have more info, do you have to travel to the location, or pay yet another membership somewhere ??
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how do you see those pages which may have more info, do you have to travel to the location, or pay yet another membership somewhere ??
I haven't attempted looking up the reference to the index records you posted an excerpt image from. What is Hall - the surname for the right-hand column? Do you have the URL of that record/image? I would need to know the collection to attempt to answer where the referenced volumes might be.
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Wow, thank again you for your direction. It will be helpful to me and others I'm sure.
Your comments are appreciated, and your right learning is always helpful, but I guess I have to start somewhere. Sometimes it's hard to know what parts to learn. Someone in the advertising business (Maybe Lord Leverbrook) said, 90 Percent of his advertising dollar is wasted. He just doesn't know which 90%. For me learning is the same, it's hard to know which parts will be useful, to know a a lot about. However I will say this as I have read a considerable amount. I find that many articles don't seem to answer the questions I have. Maybe I have a comprehension issue or bad Googler or know where to look. That's why I like this group they are helpful and patient, and informative.
I'm greatfull, many thanks, again, Happy Bunny Day.
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Ps Yes I agree baptism does have good info. Have not found that. Thanks.
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how do you see those pages which may have more info, do you have to travel to the location, or pay yet another membership somewhere ??
Just follow Adrian Bruce's advice and register at https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/login.asp.
After registering, you will be able to view birth and death records (though not marriage ones, unfortunately) and order a copy of any certificate you require - using the reference shown against the entry (again, as Adrian details above). Unfortunately, you will have to pay for a copy of the certificate that provides the full details, but it is cheaper if you order a copy to be emailed to you, rather than one sent by post.
This is how the top of your application form should look:
The bottom half provides the option of a "full" copy (sent by post) or a PDF copy. I usually order a PDF copy, as it provides all the information you should require:
Hope this helps. No doubt Adrian will advise is I have made any errors or omissions!
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BTW - You can still order marriage certificates through the GRO, but you will have to provide the reference details found on the FreeBMD website.
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Thanks for the tips. I have created an account to poke around.
It looks helpful. Im sure I will have more questions.
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