Deleting a marriage; where do the “Reason For My Change” go?
I deleted a couple relationship. On the “Delete Couple Relationship” screen I entered an explanation in the “Reason For My Change” box and clicked “Remove”. The relationship was deleted but my explanation doesn’t appear anywhere. Why?
Relationship Deleted
Husband Emery Carey 9HVD-2MH
Wife Esther Lewis LKPC-9M8
The exact same thing happened a couple of weeks ago; I called and spoke with a Family Search volunteer who was as baffled as I was. He decided he needed to escalate the matter, and said I would hear from someone. I don’t really care that I haven’t been contacted, but think it’s extremely important that the “Reasons…” appear on the record, especially when the action being taken is deleting someone else’s contribution.
Comments
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It's behaving for all the world like the reason box was left blank. The only thing I can think of is that maybe it timed out on you -- except that I'd expect that to result in an error on the action itself, rather than a reason-less action.
Maybe you could try replicating the error on the beta site? (It's easiest if you use a different browser for it, otherwise things get All Confused due to the shared login credentials.)
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Thank you. I tried the same thing on the beta site with the same result. It's not a timeout issue.
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What happens if you make another change to the person's relationships? Is it just the newest/current change log entry that's missing the reason, or does the relationship editor lose all reasons now?
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After I deleted the marriage, a daughter of the marriage still appeared on Esther's record incorrectly. I didn't want to touch this until the Comments problem was resolved. The daughter:
Clarissa E. Carey 1836–1863 • 9ZD2-DFM
As a result of your question and as a test, I deleted the parent-child relationship between Esther and Clarissa and entered a reason. The reason does appear on the changes for both of them.
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Checking the Remove box does not generate a reason statement. It would appear @Randy Clemons is leaving the reason statement blank.
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I am not leaving the reason blank!!! I have now done it 4 times... twice in the Family Tree and twice on the beta site. The reason does not show on the change for either the husband or the wife.
I would suggest that somebody try it and let us know what happens. If it works, please include the ID #s for the individuals. I'd like to see it.
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@Randy Clemons thank you for sticking with it. Okay, as a test I re-attached the wife and detached her. Here is the Change Log, with the reason statement I entered:
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Thank you @dontiknowyou, but now I’m even more confused because it just isn’t working for me. This is what I’ve been doing:
On the individual’s Details page, I:
1) Click the pencil to the right of the marriage. This brings up the Couple Relationship screen.
2) At the very bottom, there’s a trash can and Delete Relationship link which I click and a Delete Couple Relationship screen appears.
3) I put a check mark in the box and click continue and another Delete Couple Relationship screen appears.
4) I type in my brilliant reason (my two bits) and click remove.
5) I go back and view the individuals’ changes. The marriage is deleted but my comments aren’t there.
Can you see what I’m doing wrong?
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Very peculiar! What browser are you using?
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Thank you again, @dontiknowyou
I'm using Chrome.
I now see that there are two ways to delete a marriage on the Couple Relationship screen. Did you use the Remove or Replace link at the top next to the spouse or the Delete Relationship link at the bottom (which I used)?
Both of these should maintain any comments, but maybe there's a glitch with the latter option.
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@dontiknowyou Update (see my last post)
I did it again on the beta site using the Remove or Replace option and my comments did appear on the change. Now I'm convinced there's a glitch with the Delete Relationship option.
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Randy
I am just another 'lowly' User/Patron ...
Just in passing ...
'Yes', you are 100% CORRECT ...
There is a FAULT / FLAW, in the "System" ...
Whereby, the "Reason For My Change", is NOT displayed/recorded; after, "Deleting", a Relationship.
[ ie. In "ChangeLog(s)" ... for either, the individuals/persons; or, the "Couple" Relationship ... ]
Whereas ...
When, "Removing"; or, "Replacing", a Spouse, the "Reason For My Change", IS displayed/recorded; after, "Removal"; or, "Replacement", a Spouse.
[ ie. In "ChangeLog(s)" ... for either, the individuals/persons; or, the "Couple" Relationship ... ]
Plus ...
Even after, the ( ie. DELETED) "Couple" Relationship, is "Restored", the EVENT (ie. "Text") of the "Deletion", is still NOT displayed/recorded, the "Reason For My Change".
Whereas ...
After, the ( ie. DELETED) "Couple" Relationship, is "Restored", the EVENT (ie. "Text") of the "Restore", IS displayed/recorded, the "Reason For My Change".
Good pick-up.
A matter that NEEDS "Correction".
==========
Attention:
Moderators [ ie. 'FamilySearch' "Support" ( Personnel ) ]
FYI
Definitely, a problem/issue (ie. a Fault/Flaw), that NEEDS to be forwarded, to the Programmers, to address/fix.
==========
Just my thoughts.
Brett
ps: Confirmed, in the "Beta" (ie. "Test") Environment ...
.
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This is how I do it, with reason statement.
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Anyway, @Randy Clemons, there is some additional cleanup needed on the daughter's page, else the couple relationship is likely to be re-instated by a future contributor. Right now it looks like that relationship is supposed to exist.
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@dontiknowyou and @Brett . Thank you both.
I find it curious that whichever action you take, “Remove or Replace” or “Delete Relationship” the “Change” descriptor on the change log is identical … “Relationship Deleted”.
I think there should be a differentiation in the description of the actions so if someone had a problem (I would find that hard to believe, but it’s possible!), one could look at the log and determine which action had been taken.
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Randy
Just in passing ...
"Systems", are NOT easy, to "Code" for ...
"Programmers", make mistakes; and, cannot be expected to get EVERYING "Perfect".
That is WHY, "Systems" are "Tested"; before, "Release" ...
But ...
That Said ...
Even after, "Testing"; &, "Release", Problem/Issues, are found; and, "Reported"; as, in your case, for example.
Those Problems/Issues get, investigated; and, addressed/fixed.
Such, is the nature, of "Systems"/"Programmes" ...
[ Been there ... I have been a "Users Representative", on the "Development" of some "Systems"/Programmes" ]
Now ...
That Said ...
'Yes', you are CORRECT ...
In the "ChangeLog(s)" ...
One SHOULD be recorded; as, "Relationship Deleted" ...
Whereas ...
The other SHOULD be recorded; as, "Spouse Removed/Replaced" (ie. Whichever is the case) ...
That is something else, that 'FamilySearch' SHOULD consider; as, they are Two (x2) different/separate actions.
[ Essentially, doing the same thing; but, in DIFFERENT ways ... ]
Hey, but, that is just me ...
Just my thoughts.
Brett
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Is this your original no show explanation?
It seems like the change log shows the same deletion twice (there would be an adding of relationship between them if not), one with and one without reason.
Kindly, Anne-Kathrine Henriksen
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@Anne-Kathrine Henriksen (also @Brett . )
Thanks for your interest. I think the change logs are almost impossible to understand.
That said, I'm certain this was not my original reason.
After I deleted the marriage (using “Delete Relationship”), daughter Clarissa's relationships with both parents remained. I think that’s a good thing, but I then wanted to detach mother Esther Lewis. I now see there are two options on the Parent-Child Relationship screen to detach a parent: “Remove or Replace” or “Delete Parent-Child Relationship”; I likely used the former, and entered a reason. I think the Relationship Deleted entry (with reason) you are questioning was actually generated from this decoupling (for lack of any other word) of Clarissa from mother Esther Lewis. I, personally, don’t think that action should even show on Emery’s log, but can’t imagine any other reason it’s there.
Here’s some food for thought: Would using the “Delete Parent-Child Relationship” option on the Parent-Child Relationship screen also lose any reason statements?
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Randy
Just in passing ...
If I recall (from memory), it DOES appear.
I believe, the "Reason", is RETAINED; &, "Displayed", in the "ChangeLog", of the individuals/persons concerned.
I will "Test" it, later Today, in the "Beta" (ie. "Test") Environment, after I get some sleep, it's well past the 'Bewitching Hour' (ie. 1:10am), in my 'neck of the woods'.
Juts my thoughts.
Brett
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I finally had a few moments to go test this in Beta, and I believe that the procedure reached using the trashcan icon at the bottom of the relationship-editing flyout has a defect: it fails to save or show the contents of the reason box. I found an ancestor with multiple marriages and did some tests, deleting two spouses and two children using different methods (trashcan versus remove-or-replace). I typed nearly-identical reason statements each time. Here's the changelog:
Notice that tests 2 to 4 all show the reason. Test 1 does not.
I was ruthless: I went back and deleted her remaining marriage, too, using the trashcan again, but without doing anything to their children first, in case the "order of operations" matters. It doesn't:
Still no reason on the relationship deleted using the trashcan.
I went back and restored all of the relationships, and all of those actions show the reason in the changelog, but the two actions that are the result of the relationship trashcan behave for all the world like I didn't type a reason for them.
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Thanks to everyone who has tested this and determined I'm not losing it. I was fairly sure it wasn't a timeout issue and knew for certain that I had entered a "Reason ..." . I really wish it had been something I was doing wrong; that might have been embarrassing, but easy to remedy.
@Julia Szent-Györgyi , thanks for introducing me to the word "flyout". I struggled trying to determine what to call it. The word "screen" didn't seem right but that's what I settled on; "flyout" (despite the fact that it's apparently not in the spell-checker) is much better.
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