Mary Arnold L8QXP1Z

ShaenaPeterson

Mary Arnold is already sealed to her parents William Arnold G7LNG26 and Sarah Mays KHMM8ZR on 9 Jan 1969 in SL. Not sure why it is also showing that she needs to be sealed to the same parents still. Don't want to duplicate this ordinance. How can it be fixed?

Shaena

Gordon Collett

Unfortunately, these situations can get very complicated. I'm just going to complete this with a few comments and if you have a relative that would like take this on for you, you can point them here. Do remember that whatever happens in Family Tree, the ordinance work shown on your aunt's family group sheet for your Mary Arnold and her parents is kept in a separate database and is completely valid even if your Mary Arnold doesn't exit in Family Tree anymore.

Here is what happened to her various fathers:

• 8QX-PR8 (b. 1776 Astwick, Bedfordshire, no chr) merged into M949-N45
• M949-N45 (b. 16 Feb 1776, Therfield, Herefordshire, chr 8 March 1776 Therfield Hertfordshire) final surviving father
• 2SDP-Y5H (b. 1776, Astwick Bedfordshire, chr 22 Sept 1776 Hinxworth, Hertfordshire), merged into M949-N45
• MMDS-VFQ (no other info) merged into L8QX-PR8

Here is what happened to her various mothers:

• L8QX-PT8 (b. 1778, Astwick, Bedfordshire) merged into M949-NHC
• M949-NHC (b. 1778, Astwick Bedfordshire) merged into L6TB-B14
• MMDS-VFX (no other info) merged into L6TB-B14
• L6TB-B14 (b. 1779 Bedfordshire, chr 10 Jan 1779, Astwick, Bedfordshire) merged into 2SDP-YYX
• 2SDP-YYX (b. 1779 Bedfordshire, chr 10 Jan 1779, Astwick, Bedfordshire) final surviving mother.

The bits of conflicting information does raise questions about the accuracy of any of this. In any event, the final father and mother still exist as a couple in Family Tree so after they were all merged, the sealing should have shown properly. This couple do have a daughter Mary Arnold, christened 23 Nov 1803 at St. Mary, Hitchin, Hertford.

However, it was in May 2020 that the Mary Arnold you started this discussion with was removed from that family and placed in a new family with parents of the same name but very different information otherwise. That is when the blue box was placed on her ordinance page and and the new child to parent sealing became available to request, because she is now with different parents. That is also when three children under Mary and her second husband were moved to different parents.

These may all be perfectly correct and needed corrections to her record. Or it may be someone confused people and a bunch of merges need to be reversed.

Do you have someone in your family you could turn this over to? I agree that these types of situations can feel very overwhelming to untangle. It will take careful analysis of all the sources attached to everyone and co-ordinantion with the user working in May 2020 to determine who your Mary Arnold is, who her Mary Arnold is, and whether they are the same person or not, and whether there may be even more Mary Arnolds here.

Sorry I can't be more help than pointing out that someone now has a big research project to start.

DianaHawks

Checking this.

Seems the Temple List is down atm.... will try again later

Gordon Collett

This generally occurs when parents were lost in a merge or when after merging a child, the one of a set of duplicate parents were simply removed from the child rather than the parents being merged. (See https://community.familysearch.org/en/discussion/108952/child-has-father-listed-twice#latest and https://community.familysearch.org/en/discussion/108928/child-to-parent-sealing-for-my-mother-shows-that-it-was-done-and-then-it-shows-that-it-cannot-be-don#latest)

Usually if you search through the change log you can find the missing parents, get them reconnected to the child, then merge the parents.

Since Mary Arnold was born in 1804, it is also possible that someone merged two completely different Mary Arnolds born that year then detached the resulting mix of two people from the "wrong" parents. So you will need to be on the lookout for that as well.

You can also have this situation arise if Mary Arnold really was connected to the wrong parents, sealed to the wrong parents, then someone doing more research on her discovered her real parents and corrected her record. In this case, the blue box will just have to sit there.

I'll take a look also and see if I can find where the problem arose.

Gordon Collett

First step, look through the change log and identify all merges and Mary's that were merged in that were themselves product of merges:

Then take a look and see which of these ever had parents since we are only looking for that missing sealing to parents relationship. Here is the result:

So there are nine Marys that make up Mary Arnold L8QX-P1Z. I'll leave it to you to decide if all of these merges really were all combining the same Mary. Of these, only two have parents on their original records which means we can focus on them.

Gordon Collett

Here are all the parents that were on the to Marys as noted above:

That completed sealing date is to one of these sets of parents. If during or after one of the merges for Mary, someone simply deleted Mary's child to parent relationship by removing her from a set of parents, (as is often the advice given here with instructions to to the Help Center article that describes how to remove a child from a family) then that is what produced the blue box.

The next step is to follow through what happened to each of the four Williams and six Sarahs and make sure all of them were properly merged into Mary's current parents, William Arnold G7LN-G26 and Sarah Mays KHMM-8ZR, to whom she was added on May 27, 2020. I missed that set of parents when making up the above table.

One thing to be careful of, that I'll mention again, is to be sure that your Mary Arnold, with all the parents listed in the table, really is the Mary Arnold who was the child of William Arnold G7LN-G26 and Sarah Mays KHMM-8ZR. Scanning through the change log for Mary, the person working on this family in May 2020 did a lot of changes in family relationships. Several children originally listed for Mary and her husband William Clark have been moved to completely different families.

There may be a whole lot more going on here than just a lost parent child relationship. You may need to carefully go through the entire three generations of Mary, her husbands, her current children and the children that used to be listed with her, and with her parents. You will probably need to contact the user working on this family in May 2020 and find out why she made the large changes she that she did. If there were major errors that are now corrected, that sealing with a date may have been to the wrong parents. Or things may have been fine and now two or more different Marys are mixed up with each other.

I have some things I really need to get done. I'll look more at just the parent relationships listed above later.

ShaenaPeterson

Okay this is too much of a puzzle for me. She is sealed to her correct parents on the correct date according to my aunt's family group sheets so I'm not going to worry about it. I was just trying to prevent someone repeating the work. Thanks for all of your time and attention but it is beyond me.

Shaena

Carla Tobler

@ShaenaPeterson

@Gordon Collett did an excellent job explaining the possible issues that you are dealing with, and his reasoning is sound. But sometimes the puzzle is too difficult for us to solve.

For that reason, your question has been forwarded to a specialty team for review. This specialty team may contact you should they need further information or to update you on the record of Mary Arnold.

Bryan54

Mary Arnold L8QX-P1Z: Private message sent to guest with an update on the issue.