Unable to seal a child to parents if no first name is given
LYCD-9BS This child died at birth. The system will not allow sealing of that child to his parents because he has no given name. WHY? Many children which died at birth were not given names. Many names were withheld when the child died and given to the next live birth. The child is still part of the family and should be sealed. I have this and another where the family lost two infant daughters. It was a fight to get the system to accept that two children were named "Infant" and the system kept telling me tha tI was entering a duplicate. Is there no provision within the system for twins, triplets and quads etc?
Best Answer
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The solution to your problem is easy but there is only one. It is the one Brett has tried to explain and is in the help article and which any moderator here will tell you.:
(screen shots from Beta.)
Remove everything from all fields except the last name. Then you will be able to complete the sealing. After that, if you wish to put the title Master or the first name of Infant or both back in, you can.
If you attempt this and still get an orange square, post a screen shot.
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Answers
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FYI
I am just another 'lowly' User/Patron ...
[ And, I happen to be a member of the Church ... ]
FIRSTLY ...
I think that 'FamilySearch Person Identifier' (PID) of that LYCD-9BS; as, that particular individual/person , appears to have "Lived" to 'Adulthood'; and, got Married.
SECONDLY ...
FYI
A Child that "Lived" (ie. but, NOT a "Stillborn" Child) CAN be "Sealed" to their Parents; even, if they DO NOT, receive; or, have, a 'Given' "Name".
Here is a "Knowledge Article" in 'FamilySearch':
Temple ordinances for unnamed children
https://www.familysearch.org/help/helpcenter/article/temple-ordinances-for-unnamed-child
Where is states, among other things
Quote
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Sometimes you need to perform ordinances for someone whose name is not known.
If you cannot find the name of a person but still want to have temple ordinances performed, enter the information below into the Name field:
- For an individual with an unknown name or a child who died without receiving a name, enter only the last name of the father or family name into the surname field. Do not enter a first name. Do not enter Mr., Miss, son, or daughter. Be sure the sex is correctly entered as male or female.
When the cards are printed, Mr. or Miss is added to the name.
Temple ordinances are not performed for stillborn children.
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And ...
Just in case ...
Temple work for a stillborn child
https://www.familysearch.org/help/helpcenter/article/temple-work-for-stillborn-babies
I hope that this may help.
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Thanks for your reply. However, first, the identifier is for the parent. Second, no matter what this says, the system will not allow for the child to be sealed. It states clearly that the person has to have a first name to be sealed. Third, this is not the first time this has happened, as I said.
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FYI
Now ...
In regards to the OTHER matter of the TWO (x2) infant Daughters ...
The REAL problem/issue with that matter, was that the fact you recorded the "First Names"; as, that of "Infant".
There are "Words" that CANNOT be used as part a "Name", for "Temple" Word.
Such "Words", are so being used, in their contextual meaning, rather than as an ACTUAL Name.
In such cases, 'FamilySearch, needs to verify that the "Word" being used, is actually part of the actual "Name", rather than just being used as its contextual meaning - as, in the case of the "Word', of "Infant".
Here is a "Knowledge Article" in 'FamilySearch':
What words and abbreviations cause "Needs more information" to appear?
Please be aware that that list of "Words" is NOT exhaustive.
And, you will notice that "Infant" is such a "Word".
In such cases, the BEST course of action, is to leave the "First Names" Field; as, "Blank" (ie. NOTHING).
I hope this helps.
Brett
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FYI
I am sorry, to appear contradictory ...
But ...
I KNOW that the "First Names" Field CAN be "Blank"/"Empty" (ie. NOTHING); and, the "Temple" Work STILL. "Reserved"; and, undertaken, for a CHILD with NO 'Given Name', in the "First Names" Field.
I KNOW; as, I has been able to do such.
Brett
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Thanks. It appears that no matter what I experienced you are going to tell me that it didn't, doesn't and never will happen. Guess I just have to accept that it is my imagination that has deceived me. Somehow, I haven't found your "help" as helpful.
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Here is a copy of the message that is given for rejecting the sealing to a parent for this child. SP = Sealing to Parent.
The ID for the child is LYCD-9BS
SP
Sealing to Parents
Cannot Request - Needs More Information
- This person has a title and last name but no first name. Below are the parents names.
Male
1863–1936
• LK11-DPT
Female
1859–1941
• LK11-6KK
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Curtis
'Thank You' ...
FIRSTLY ...
As I indicated, that 'FamilySearch Person Identifier' (PID) of LYCD-9BS, for the Child, is INCORRECT.
The 'FamilySearch Person Identifier' (PID), for the Child, is actually, LYZD-9BS, being Infant BROMAGHIM.
SECONDLY ...
As I also indicated, the REASON, that you are having the problem/issue, with "Reserving" the "Temple" Work, for that Child; is BECAUSE, that you have entered, the 'Given' Name, in the "First Names" Field; as, that of the "Word" of "Infant".
The "Word" of "Infant"; as, a 'Given' Name, in the "First Names" Field, is being used, in its contextual meaning, rather than as an ACTUAL Name; as, the Child had NO 'Given Name'.
THIRDLY ...
The way, for you, to be able to "Reserve", the "Temple" Work, for that Child, is SIMPLY to "Delete"/"Remove", that 'Given' Name, in the "First Names" Field, of (the "Word" of) "Infant"; and, LEAVE that "First Names"; as, "Blank"/"Empty" (ie. NOTHING).
FINALLY ...
When the 'Card' for the "Temple" Work of that Child is "Printed", the "System" will "Automatically" ADD the honorific of, "Mr."; as, there is NO 'Given' Name, in the "First Names" Field.
That honorific of "Mr.", along with the Child's 'Family Name' / 'Surname' of BROMAGHIM, will be used in the "Temple" Work, of "Sealing to Patents" for that Child.
Go on, give it a go.
"Delete"/"Remove", that 'Given' Name, in the "First Names" Field, of (the "Word" of) "Infant"; and, just LEAVE that "First Names" Field; as, "Blank"/"Empty" (ie. NOTHING).
Then, try "Reserving" the "Temple" Work, of "Sealing to Patents", for that Child.
Let us know if this works or not.
Brett
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Have tried it blank. Does not work. Thanks for your time. This is over.
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Curtis
FYI
I am sorry, that you are feeling such angst ...
And ...
I just took a look at the "ChangeLog" for that Child of BROMAGHIM ( LYZD-9BS ) ...
https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/changelog/LYZD-9BS/preferred-name
That "ChangeLog", indicates, that you DID NOT, "Change" the "First Names" Field, by "Deleting"/"Removing", ANY 'Given' Name, from the "First Names" Field; and, leaving, that "First Names" Field; as, "Blank"/"Empty" (ie. NOTHING).
In fact ...
The "ChangeLog", indicates, that the ORIGINAL "First Names" when the Child was Created, was CORRECT; and, should have REMAINED as such.
The Iterations of "First Names" of that Child, according to the "ChangeLog" are ...
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25 November 2017 ... When CREATED ... "Blank" (ie. NOTHING)
28 December 2019 ... Changed ... Master
And, Today, by you ...
10 October 2021 ... Changed (1) ... Master Infant
10 October 2021 ... Changed (2) ... Infant
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I humbly feel, that you may personally, not like leaving ,the "First Names" Field; as, "Blank"/"Empty" (ie. NOTHING).
Please DO NOT be concerned about leaving the "First Names" Field; as, "Blank"/"Empty" (ie. NOTHING).
That is WHAT we are REQUIRED to do - for an "Unnamed" Child, to do the "Temple" Work.
As an aside ...
And, just to be certain ...
In the "Beta" (ie. Test) Environment" ...
I tried, what I suggested to you, with that particular Child; and, when I "Deleted"/"Removed", the 'Given' Name, in the "First Names" Field; and, just LEFT that "First Names" Field; as, "Blank"/"Empty" (ie. NOTHING), the "Temple" Work, of "Sealing to Parents", WAS then available to "Reserve" - ie. in the "Beta" (ie. Test) Environment".
Again, I am sorry, that you are feeling such angst ...
I only wanted to help/assist.
Brett
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Well, today it finally let me do so. Thank you both.
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